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When the Electronic Fence Goes Up.
April 2nd 2003, 19:18 CEST by Mank

Just last year alone China, the country with the most recorded blocks and redirects, substantially increased the number of websites that were actively being blocked or redirected. This site lists hundreds of sites that are, or at one point, were being blocked during the course of 2002. A quick glance of the sites being blocked shows an inherently high number of religious and government web sites, along with some personal tripod members homepages as well. Even Id Software has fallen victim to the blocking, albeit to a lesser degree as is indicated by the information provided. It would appear that popular Western Culture is perhaps the main target in China's case, but the lack of any solid trending makes this argument hard to support.

So far the US has refrained from blocking foreign websites at the government level, but recent challenges to the Internet Decency Act, along with recent changes made in congress, might give the US Govt. the legal means to either block, or shutdown foreign websites that violate US law. This could include foreign sites that contain articles about the use of drugs for a purpose not approved of by the FDA, as well as certain (prohibited) advertising. (i.e. Securities, or material that is considered obscene)

It used to be argued that content in foreign media was intended solely for its own people, and is regulated under its own governmental law. However, the free and open nature of the internet has changed all of that. What happens to the right of the individual, in being able to choose what they see from the privacy of their own computer when the government makes these choices for them? And more importantly, what becomes of the internet?
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Home » Topic: When the Electronic Fence Goes Up.

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#1 by Euri
2003-04-02 19:22:38
yolora@attbi.com http://www.eurikins.com
Blocking internet sites is never a good thing, really.

I don't think the US could manage to do it on any large scale, due to the general computer literacy that is present in our country. Eventually, using proxies designed to bypass these blocks would become popular.

Lol hi =]
#2 by Gunp01nt
2003-04-02 19:27:42
supersimon33@hotmail.com
how would they block websites? by the domain? they could only have full control at the root level, but since most providers have their own DNS servers, and almost every OS keeps a cached DNS, that ain't gonna fly really well.

china is obviously able to do this because it started blocking websites from the beginning, and has more control over ISP's.

Yo mama's so fat, all the restaurants in town have signs that says: "Maximum Occupancy: 240 Patrons OR Yo Mama"
#3 by LPMiller
2003-04-02 19:27:48
lpmiller@gotapex.com http://www.gotapex.com
I agree. They could try, but they'd fail.

I believe I can fly......urk.
#4 by Matt Davis
2003-04-02 19:39:16
http://looroll.com
If you look at Saudi Arabia they censor massively, even incoming post is censored to an extreme degree, and its not just political content but pretty much any content (I'm pretty sure they have everything blocked to start with and just tell the ISPs what they will allow).

People do get round it but it costs them an international call rate to use an ISP outside of the country, and you have to hope you don't get caught.

Troll, troll, troll your post, gently down the page...
#5 by Euri
2003-04-02 19:45:53
yolora@attbi.com http://www.eurikins.com
Wouldn't it be unconstitutional to limit access here anyway, because the networks we use are by and large privately owned?

When I am on Comcast (AT&T's) network, it's THEIR network. Why would anyone have the right to regulate it?

Lol hi =]
#6 by Trolly McTroll
2003-04-02 19:53:29
Game makers threaten action against hackers who remove cyberbabes' bikinis

Are the Tecmo Execs a bunch of Faggies?

"..and Trolly McTroll is the best name EVER. I laugh every time I see it."  - I'm ZEP Damn it!
" If i ever have a daughter, I'm going to name her Trolly. - The_Joker
#7 by Trolly McTroll
2003-04-02 19:57:50
Here they are Nude and you can get the nude patch here.

"..and Trolly McTroll is the best name EVER. I laugh every time I see it."  - ZEP
" If i ever have a daughter, I'm going to name her Trolly. - The_Joker
#8 by jjohnsen
2003-04-02 19:57:58
http://www.johnsenclan.com
I'm not sure how comfortable I'd be using a nude-crack on a console game.

Lest we forget we need a name for the main character.  Something edgy, like Killden Allded, Maxamillian (Max) Power, or our all time favorite Dick Justice.

Funk.
#9 by Warren Marshall
2003-04-02 20:08:16
http://www.wantonhubris.com/
Just how lonely do you have to be to want to see the DOA girls nude?
#10 by Matt Davis
2003-04-02 20:16:37
http://looroll.com
When I am on Comcast (AT&T's) network, it's THEIR network. Why would anyone have the right to regulate it?

Because the its on US soil and the US Government and regulatory bodies get to set laws/rules to protect people.

Blocking access to some sites is legal, not just from a law perspective but also a copyright/ownership side.

Troll, troll, troll your post, gently down the page...
#11 by Your Friend
2003-04-02 20:18:47
License2KimJongill

If it has been posted here before, fuck you!

2000/XP is better than Win9x in every way.
#12 by Euri
2003-04-02 20:28:02
yolora@attbi.com http://www.eurikins.com
Because the its on US soil and the US Government and regulatory bodies get to set laws/rules to protect people.


But how is blocking a site protecting me, even if it's a really divisive animal porn + communism site?

I know a lot of people would like it to be true, but the Government does not have the right/ability to tell you what to do at every given moment.  I don't think any sort of censorship law would last very long when put up to the supreme court.

Lol hi =]
#13 by Mank
2003-04-02 21:19:18
I don't think any sort of censorship law would last very long when put up to the supreme court.


Is it really censorship if it deals with content that doesnt originate(read created) here on US soil, thus not offering it constitutional protection? This gets right back to the issue of other people live by other laws. What may be legal in one country, may not necessarily be legal here.

I'm not for site blocking of any kind.....but current trends do indicate that more and more governments are becoming involved with the practice.

"A great deal of intelligence can be invested in ignorance when the need for illusion is deep."
#14 by Phayyde
2003-04-02 21:24:08
Question:  Can one reliably detect if their access is being filtered?

Beat to fit, paint to match.
#15 by Ashiran
2003-04-02 21:28:34
But how is blocking a site protecting me,

You are protected if the state is protected. The state is protected if nobody questions the state.

So the less you know the safer you are!

#16 by Phayyde
2003-04-02 21:31:35
...the hell's an "overpositor"?

Beat to fit, paint to match.
#17 by VeeSPIKE
2003-04-02 21:50:21
my thought is that it is supposed to be 'ovipositor', an insect appendage used to lay eggs.

The media doesn't educate, it sensationalizes. That's why there's no learning curve, just repeated bouts of gross stupidity. Bailey
#18 by Matt Davis
2003-04-02 22:04:57
http://looroll.com
But how is blocking a site protecting me, even if it's a really divisive animal porn + communism site?

It may not protect you as an individual but blocking sites may help to protect the the general population, are you saying sites that have content such as child pornography, bomb making, snuff movies and other such disturbing things shouldn't be blocked by the government if they feel that its for the good of the population?

What about the victims and the victims families? how would you feel if it was someone you knew that was featured in there? let alone you.

I'm all for freedom of speech, but I believe it has its limits and people need to see that.

Troll, troll, troll your post, gently down the page...
#19 by Mank
2003-04-02 22:27:39
Phayyde in #14:
Question:  Can one reliably detect if their access is being filtered?


Detect?...dunno about beforehand....But if you question whether or not you are being blocked from a site, you can use one of the numerous Gateway sites and run a traceroute to the IP in question from a foreign location.

"A great deal of intelligence can be invested in ignorance when the need for illusion is deep."
#20 by Ashiran
2003-04-02 23:29:04
Better?

#21 by Trolly McTroll
2003-04-02 23:34:03
"Do boys like games more than girls? My assumption is no, they don't, and the market is underserving women," Horwitz said. "I don't fundamentally think that boys like games more than girls."  

What a fag!

"..and Trolly McTroll is the best name EVER. I laugh every time I see it."  - ZEP
" If i ever have a daughter, I'm going to name her Trolly. - The_Joker
#22 by Phayyde
2003-04-03 00:08:19
Mank:  Good.   So filter detection requires an unfiltered, trusted third party.  And even then there would be false positives.

I was wondering how valuable it would be to set up an offshore RU-Filtered.com service that would employ some simple functionality to tell a subscriber whether or not (s)he was being denied access to a certain IP, domain or URL.   However, since intentional filters would be indistinguishable from false positives, I'm thinking the service would not really be very useful.


Ashiran: Yessir!

Beat to fit, paint to match.
#23 by UncleJeet
2003-04-03 00:13:03
I suspect that this topic is somewhat political in nature.  Therefore,

MARIO RULES!MARIO RULES!MARIO RULES!MARIO RULES!MARIO RULES!MARIO RULES!MARIO RULES!MARIO RULES!MARIO RULES!MARIO RULES!MARIO RULES!MARIO RULES!MARIO RULES!MARIO RULES!MARIO RULES!MARIO RULES!MARIO RULES!MARIO RULES!MARIO RULES!MARIO RULES!MARIO RULES!MARIO RULES!MARIO RULES!MARIO RULES!MARIO RULES!MARIO RULES!MARIO RULES!MARIO RULES!MARIO RULES!MARIO RULES!MARIO RULES!MARIO RULES!MARIO RULES!MARIO RULES!MARIO RULES!MARIO RULES!MARIO RULES!

Thank you.

I'm fighting terrorism by playing violent video games!
#24 by Shadarr
2003-04-03 00:21:01
shadarr@yahoo.com http://digital-luddite.com
I thought Zelda was the one that was rulin right now.  What has Mario done lately?
#25 by Your Friend
2003-04-03 00:42:30
Mario Sunshine was a very good game, but really not even in the same league as the new Zelda.

2000/XP is better than Win9x in every way.
#26 by Eric T. Cheng
2003-04-03 01:22:36
erictcheng@hotmail.com
how would they block websites? by the domain? they could only have full control at the root level, but since most providers have their own DNS servers, and almost every OS keeps a cached DNS, that ain't gonna fly really well.

china is obviously able to do this because it started blocking websites from the beginning, and has more control over ISP's.


China has a massive firewall, through the help of companies such as Cisco at the root of their country's connection to the Internet.

Kilt Wearing Pixel Pushing Monkey Boy
IMDB Entry
DVD Collection
#27 by Ergo
2003-04-03 01:26:44
Eric, a word of advice:

Never, ever use Newsmax as a reference.

Unneeded Editor -- Respawn Games

DVDs
#28 by Your Friend
2003-04-03 01:26:58
There was also a recent hullabaloo about Google helping China filter google searches.

While that isn't quite the same as blocking a website, given the ubiquitousness of google searches as a means to find information one is looking for, it's damn close.

2000/XP is better than Win9x in every way.
#29 by Eric T. Cheng
2003-04-03 01:30:21
erictcheng@hotmail.com
Never, ever use Newsmax as a reference.


Why may I ask?

Kilt Wearing Pixel Pushing Monkey Boy
IMDB Entry
DVD Collection
#30 by bago
2003-04-03 01:34:23
manga_Rando@hotmail.com
Xamswen!

The seeming unanimity among poets makes them look suspiciously like a herd of independent minds.
#31 by LPMiller
2003-04-03 01:40:20
lpmiller@gotapex.com http://www.gotapex.com
Why may I ask?


Oh, I dunno. Perhaps, perhaps I say, if you were to check the front page of newsmaxx, you'd understand why.

Though I have to respect a 'news' site that posts the headline French Sickos Side With Saddam, and then proceeds to call them frogs in the body of the text.

Other then that, they might be a little slanted.

I believe I can fly......urk.
#32 by Creole Ned
2003-04-03 01:49:43
Time to start working on those resumes again!

"I don't bemoan the great paste" - LPMiller
#33 by jjohnsen
2003-04-03 01:51:39
http://www.johnsenclan.com
I believe the tech thread has left the front page, so does anyone mind if I ask a quickie in this one?  We have DSL right now and it works fine.  Comcast just started offering broadband cable in our area for about $5 more.  We were thinking about signing up and ditching our DSL and landline totally and just use our cell phones as our number.  Has anyone else done this and is it less difficult than it seems, like is it impossible for people to find you?

Lest we forget we need a name for the main character.  Something edgy, like Killden Allded, Maxamillian (Max) Power, or our all time favorite Dick Justice.

Funk.
#34 by Eric T. Cheng
2003-04-03 02:04:00
erictcheng@hotmail.com
Though I have to respect a 'news' site that posts the headline French Sickos Side With Saddam, and then proceeds to call them frogs in the body of the text.

Other then that, they might be a little slanted.


Ah. I also sensed the writer was foaming at the mouth while he wrote the article.

Kilt Wearing Pixel Pushing Monkey Boy
IMDB Entry
DVD Collection
#35 by Ergo
2003-04-03 02:11:49
Read some of the other "articles" if you want a couple of good belly laughs.

Unneeded Editor -- Respawn Games

DVDs
#36 by mrbloo
2003-04-03 02:15:17
mrbloo2000@hotmail.com
Salam Pax in his blog talked about google being blocked by their ISP in Iraq.  He was popular in the office for showing people how to get around it.

I'm against any such blocking of sites by a government proxy.  I believe such acts to be censorship and not far removed from banning people from viewing foreign television channels or listening to the BBC world service.  Why should the government decide what you can or cannot read?

Does anyone remember Bush's quote after he saw the satirical site www.gwbush.com?

"There ought to be limits to freedom."


As Bill Hicks said, "You are free, to do what we tell you."
#37 by lwf
2003-04-03 02:16:10
jjjjjjjohnsen

That's exactly what I'm doing, my cable has served me well and my cellphone is my phone. My roommate has a landline but nobody calls me on it. I think as long as everyone knows your cell number you'll be a-ok.

Integrity is like virginity, worthless until lost.
#38 by Dinglehoffen
2003-04-03 02:19:03
Fanny Fungus
Anyone who surfs the net looking for war-filth or death pics - or even taking pleasure in viewing them - is  a disgusting pig.

"I don't care what Major Pierce said. I have never cared what he said, and I don't care now what he said, and as a matter of fact I'm trying not to care that I don't care about what he said more than I ever have before!"
Frank Burns, M*A*S*H
#39 by Ergo
2003-04-03 02:20:26
We value your input.

Unneeded Editor -- Respawn Games

DVDs
#40 by The_Joker
2003-04-03 02:22:13
http://www.jackinworld.com
No we don't.

Joker, Ph.D. Procedural Assholian Behaviour, Pedophilosopher
- All your ass are belong to my wang Jafd. Prepare to are penetration.
"I fart in THX." - Sgt_Hulka

PENETRATOR: Rise of the Wang Cuming "When it's done".
#41 by The_Joker
2003-04-03 02:29:54
http://www.jackinworld.com
#40 I'm sorry, we do.

That license to kim young ill site is fucking hilarious.

ROR!

Joker, Ph.D. Procedural Assholian Behaviour, Pedophilosopher
- All your ass are belong to my wang Jafd. Prepare to are penetration.
"I fart in THX." - Sgt_Hulka

PENETRATOR: Rise of the Wang Cuming "When it's done".
#42 by Leslie Nassar
2003-04-03 02:45:06
http://departmentofinternets.com
i made a couple of wallpaper's based on my photography if anyone's interested.  they're both 1280x1024.

Three Cops (preview is here)

Bike Cop (preview is here)

obdisclaimer:  i love america!
#43 by LPMiller
2003-04-03 02:47:36
lpmiller@gotapex.com http://www.gotapex.com
Sorry, my desktop isn't allowed free expession of political views. It is allowed scanned artwork from my daughter, however.

I believe I can fly......urk.
#44 by Leslie Nassar
2003-04-03 02:48:29
http://departmentofinternets.com
fascist!  :-P

obdisclaimer:  i love america!
#45 by None-1a
2003-04-03 02:49:35
jjohnsen that's been working great for me. Other then nightly charging and the phone on me at all times (both mainly because I'll forget if I don't do it regularly) it's but a more convenient landline for me. Like lwf said as long as you give the number out it's easy to find you (better then the alternative really since there's just the cell number for them to try).
#46 by LPMiller
2003-04-03 02:52:47
lpmiller@gotapex.com http://www.gotapex.com
However, they are very nice photos, Leslie.

I believe I can fly......urk.
#47 by mrbloo
2003-04-03 02:54:56
mrbloo2000@hotmail.com
Great pictures.  The Three Cops one is going on the desktop until the next shiny thing catches my eye.
#48 by Eric T. Cheng
2003-04-03 02:58:53
erictcheng@hotmail.com
We have DSL right now and it works fine.  Comcast just started offering broadband cable in our area for about $5 more.  We were thinking about signing up and ditching our DSL and landline totally and just use our cell phones as our number.  Has anyone else done this and is it less difficult than it seems, like is it impossible for people to find you?


I don't have a landline and my cell is my only phone because when I was employed I spent most of my time at the office so what was the point of having a landline if I wasn't home that often. I couldn't get DSL because Telus requires a landline phone first, whereas Shaw doesn't require me to have tv cable to get Internet cable access (I don't have a tv).

Kilt Wearing Pixel Pushing Monkey Boy
IMDB Entry
DVD Collection
#49 by jjohnsen
2003-04-03 03:00:14
http://www.johnsenclan.com
So this whole time I've been thinking you where making a political statement Leslie.  But really you've just been advertising desktops.

Lest we forget we need a name for the main character.  Something edgy, like Killden Allded, Maxamillian (Max) Power, or our all time favorite Dick Justice.

Funk.
#50 by lwf
2003-04-03 03:05:24
Eric I'm pretty sure if you hook up your cable from your modem to a tv you'll get signal.

Integrity is like virginity, worthless until lost.
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