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The Sword Of Truth
June 2nd 2000, 18:23 CEST by andy

Have you noticed that Daikatana hasn't had any bad reviews?



You haven't? Well, that's probably because it has been getting slated all over the place. But that's not the impression you'd get if you go to Voodoo Extreme for your daily dose of gaming news.

Currently, if you trawl back through the VE archives you'll find around a dozen links to Daikatana articles. Some are walkthroughs, some are commentaries and some are positive reviews. Only one is mildly negative, and that's just a "first look" at the game.

So why have Billy and the gang at VE decided not to link to any negative Daikatana reviews?

Is it because all of those reviews have been so badly written that they don't deserve to be linked? Are the reviews so prejudiced against John Romero that they are more like personal vendettas than critiques? Or has VE decided, for some reason, to go all shiny-happy and only link to nice reviews?

If none of those ideas seem plausible then perhaps it has something to do with Voodoo Extreme being owned by the GameFan network, GameFan being owned by retail group Express.com, and Express.com being part-owned by Eidos, publisher of Daikatana.

Let's hope this is all just a wild conspiracy theory, but after the recent news about Apogee's press-licensing antics, would it be much of a surprise if Eidos was trying to suppress negative reviews of its game? The GameFan network consists of around forty sites and claims 3.5m unique visitors each month, so if there really is some damage control going on it could certainly help to shift more units.

Sticking with Eidos and GameFan for a moment, comments recently posted by Rich "Lowtax" Kyanka on the GameFan-hosted site Something Awful suggest that everything is not as it should be at the network:

In the four or five months I've been working for Gamefan / Express.com, they've never sent checks on time once.

They're a month behind in pay, and although we're supposed to be getting paid around the 26th of every month, we hardly ever get a check until the 3rd of the next month.

[...]

Despite the fact that I'm paying for my own hosting and bandwidth, I still get the same CPM as sites which are hosted on their servers and don't pay a dime. [...] I don't want any special privileges, I just want to get a damn paycheck for the endless series of stupid "Daikatana" banner ads I serve up every day.

Oops, there's the 'D' word again!

Although this isn't a major issue (company doesn't pay staff on time, shock horror) it's disappointing to know that it's happening at one of the largest games networks, especially one that is owned by a company such as Eidos.

Apparently Eidos doesn't mind forking out $35m for the glass Dallas phallus, a load of hair-care products and various anatomical enhancements, but funding for Looking Glass Studios and staff payments aren't such a high priority. There's something backwards about that...

Finally, if you have a look at the Daikatana page on the Express.com retail site, which superseded GameFan's own "GameCave" retailer, you'll notice that one of the game's features is "killer multiplayer capabilities for free network, and low latency internet play".

Does this clever wording mean that the game is only suitable for LAN's and broadband connections? If this is the case, and therefore Daikatana isn't suitable for normal modem play, shouldn't this be stated more clearly?

C O M M E N T S
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#1 by "Happy cow"
2000-06-02 18:25:12
happycow30@hotmail.com http://happycow.home.icq.com
first


Happy cow (fast bovine)<I><B></B></I><I></I><I></I>
#2 by "Jafd"
2000-06-02 18:34:26
jafd@whatthefuck.com
I don't go to VE. I go to Blue's. Seen plenty of generally non-positive reviews linked from there.

Voodoo Extreme... isn't upholding the highest standards of journalistic integrity? Get out! Next you're going to tell me there is no Tooth Fairy, or Santa Claus... or Jesus! Aiieeeeee!


Here's another take on it; thank God those good people at Looking Glass got out from under those... <i>folks</i> at Eidos.<I><B></B></I><I></I><I></I>
#3 by "Steve Bauman"
2000-06-02 18:35:53
sbauman@adelphia.net http://homepages.together.net/~sbauman/
<quote>killer multiplayer capabilities for free network, and low latency internet play</quote>
I think that's a poorly worded way of saying, "It's playable for free over the Internet, and it's very smooth." ("Low latency" meaning there's little lag.)
#4 by "PiRaMidA"
2000-06-02 18:38:39
piramida@usa.net http://www.agsm.net
Well Andy, what about the GameFan - hosted SA which maybe is rotating D banners but still I have not seen much (if any) positive stuff about it on SA. <i>"Recommended games: Anything but Daikatana"</i> - and etc.

If it would be a network policy, I doubt lowtax would be writing stuff like that, especially that he did not really need to say so :)<I><B></B></I><I></I><I></I>
#5 by "asspennies"
2000-06-02 18:39:18
asspennies@coredump.org http://www.coredump.org
I wouldn't know about Voodoo Extreme - I don't really like my gaming news "Honey Roasted", "Spicy", or filled with inane and juvenile sexual innuendo.  I much prefer to get my gaming news from a combination of <a href="http://www.bluesnews.com">Blue's</a> and <a href=www.oldmanmuray.com>Old Man Murray.</a>

As for Something Awful, I always felt it was more suited to UGO anyway, and much more of a better fit in the Portal Of Evil network.  Oh well.

<I><B></B></I><I></I><I></I>
#6 by "Dethstryk"
2000-06-02 18:39:59
dethstryk@damagegaming.com http://www.damagegaming.com/
So, what's going on with the topic anyway? Voodoo Extreme not linking to negative Daikatana reviews and Lowtax not getting paid on time?

I don't know, but through all of my time VE has been around, I've noticed they don't post many reviews. No problem here.

Still, I'm curious as to what all this is about. I realize speculation is part of the wonder that is the 'Crap, but this one is just kind of shooting way over any kind of possible target I can see.


--
Dethstryk
Damage Gaming
#7 by "ilian"
2000-06-02 18:41:37
ilian@rewolfsoftware.com http://www.rewolfsoftware.com
<b>#3</b> "Steve Bauman" wrote...
<QUOTE>I think that's a poorly worded way of saying, "It's playable for free over the Internet, and it's very smooth." ("Low latency" meaning there's little lag.) </QUOTE>

gotta agree with you here. It says "Diakatana multiplayer is free, and there is very little lag while playing it." It doesn't mean that diakatana is meant to be -played over "low-latency networks"

-ilian
#8 by "Happy cow"
2000-06-02 18:43:13
happycow30@hotmail.com http://happycow.home.icq.com
Hey, if I don't read it at Old man Murray's it aint news.

Happy Cow (Murray's fan cow, he's bigger then Apache)<I><B></B></I><I></I><I></I>
#9 by "Morn"
2000-06-02 18:47:34
morn@planetcrap.com http://www.planetcrap.com
In some twisted and perverted way, I somehow wish there was a "world news" site in the Voodoo Extreme writing style.

(It'd certainly get some Pokemon players to be more political!)

- Morn
#10 by "Dethstryk"
2000-06-02 18:52:30
dethstryk@damagegaming.com http://www.damagegaming.com/
<b>#9</b> "Morn" wrote...
<QUOTE>In some twisted and perverted way, I somehow wish there was a "world news" site in the Voodoo Extreme writing style.

(It'd certainly get some Pokemon players to be more political!)</QUOTE>
It sounds like it would be a fun idea, but I doubt anyone would really even take something like that seriously. I think it is probably a chore for a lot of people to read the same sexual references in every post day after day.

I'm not trying to slam Voodoo Extreme or Billy in anyway of course. He's a great guy, but it's perfectly acceptable if I don't like something that he does.


--
Dethstryk
Damage Gaming
#11 by "Desiato"
2000-06-02 19:05:08
desiato_hotblack@hotmail.com http://www.spew2.com
Just wait until Lowtax gets here. Heh.

Frankly -- I like his site, always thought he had the best "net humor" around, and if the people at GameFan can't get off their asses and pay up on time, then -- perhaps affiliating with another network is in order.

I'd offer to host him, but then I probably wouldn't be able to use my DSL for anything else. ;-)

As far as Daikatana reviews. Um......why?

Do we really need to see links to "bad" reviews to know what we already do? Does it ultimately matter?

Better yet -- get over to www.somethingawful.com and buy a T-Shirt. I can't wait for mine to arrive.

Desiato
#12 by "Steve Bauman"
2000-06-02 19:12:32
sbauman@adelphia.net http://homepages.together.net/~sbauman/
<quote>Do we really need to see links to "bad" reviews to know what we already do? Does it ultimately matter? </quote>
No, but as the article says, the only review they linked to were (relatively) positive ones (I think one was Apache's review at GameFan, which was a 77/100). So while "we" may know the game is getting bad reviews, do the people visiting VE know?

Probably, but that's not really the point, is it? Obviously they can choose to link to whatever they want, but if they're pushing some sort of agenda, that should probably be disclosed so their readers know where they're coming from.
#13 by "Morn"
2000-06-02 19:18:25
morn@planetcrap.com http://www.planetcrap.com
Dethstryk, it really was my way of saying how much I hated Voodoo Extreme's style. :)

- Morn
#14 by "Martin"
2000-06-02 19:21:50
martin@theplace.nu http://martin.theplace.nu
Shut up Andy. How often do you read VE? Billy and Lowtax (from Something Awful, also on GameFan) has been slamming Daikatana since day one.

The fact that you are posting the majority of the stories here is the only reason I'm not visiting PC more than once a week or so. To bad as PC could be a neat place.

Try and keep a check on your paranoia from time to time.

-- Martin
#15 by "Dethstryk"
2000-06-02 19:22:21
dethstryk@damagegaming.com http://www.damagegaming.com/
<b>#13</b> "Morn" wrote...
<QUOTE>Dethstryk, it really was my way of saying how much I hated Voodoo Extreme's style. :)</QUOTE>
Too bad the art of being subtle passes over me sometime. Didn't realize that one. :)


--
Dethstryk
Damage Gaming
#16 by "Martin"
2000-06-02 19:26:29
martin@theplace.nu http://martin.theplace.nu
This time I didn't get all the way through Andys post before I posted my first comment so some of the above stuff might sound a bit odd. Well, the first paragraph at least. The other two are perfectly ok though.

-- Martin
#17 by "MCorleone"
2000-06-02 19:42:12
john_st123@hotmail.com
"Glass Dallas Phallus"

Was that said with malice?
#18 by "Darkseid"
2000-06-02 20:22:36
Darkseid-D@planetcrap.com http://www.captured.com/boomstick
Any site that gives Lowtax a job, is hardly the echelon of class ....

;)

*nyah*


Ds<I><B></B></I><I></I><I></I>
#19 by "Warren Marshall"
2000-06-02 20:40:49
warren@epicgames.com http://www.epicgames.com
I think Lowtax runs a great site.  SomethingAwful is one of the highlights of my web surfing day.  One of the main things I like about it, is that it's funny and generally clean.  He doesn't have to resort to incessant references to "ass", "masturbation" or any other body part or function that other web sites seem to feel the need to.

He manages to be funny without catering to the lowest common denominator.  :)
#20 by "PainKilleR-[CE]"
2000-06-02 21:13:09
painkiller@planetfortress.com http://www.planetfortress.com/tftech/
I think someone forgot to mention JeffK's gloriously funny review of Daikatana that absolutely slammed it every which way into the ground. It just seems pretty strange to me that they might be trying to keep VE from linking to reviews that show the game in a bad light, but at the same time don't do anything about a review on somethingawful that basically equates the best thing about Daikatana being that Killcreek got breast implants.

-PainKilleR-[CE]
#21 by "Darkseid"
2000-06-02 21:14:59
Darkseid-D@planetcrap.com http://www.captured.com/boomstick
OxyMoron

JeffK and funny.



Ds<I><B></B></I><I></I><I></I>
#22 by "flamethrower"
2000-06-02 21:15:00
flamey_at_evil@hotmail.com http://flamethrower.evilavatar.com
Yeah, it's alternative comedy. First was clean comedy. Then the filth. Then the filth got boring. Back to the clean. Oh, tits.<I><B></B></I><I></I><I></I>
#23 by "crash"
2000-06-02 21:15:06
crash@planetcrap.com http://www.planetcrap.com
<i>would it be much of a surprise if Eidos was trying to suppress negative reviews of its game?</i>

hmm. don't know about this one. in a way, i'm sure eidos isn't particularly pleased with the ratio of good to bad reviews Dai has been getting. i mean, who would be? on the other side of the coin, tho, you know the old adage: any press is good press. (no, i don't believe it either, but there it is.)

but suppress? so they're allegedly trying to make things look shiny and happy on a network of sites they own which gets, according to Andy's article, 3.5m a month for the network. last time i checked, Blue's alone was gettin 60k a day by itself, and it's probably more now. so we'll lowball Blue's and say he gets 2m a month, which is 65% of the total network traffic the gamefan sites get. and that's just one site that reports all the reviews, not just the positive ones.

er. if Eidos <i>is</i> tryin to suppress negative reviews, they sure are doin a fuck-all job of it, imho. :)
#24 by "flamethrower"
2000-06-02 21:18:03
flamey_at_evil@hotmail.com http://flamethrower.evilavatar.com
crash - Blue reports <b>some</b> reviews, not all.

You can be banal, you can be illiterate, you can swear, you can grovel, you can rant, you can give any manner of pisspoor review (or, of course, good one) but once you've pissed Blue off once that's you sent to Coventry.
<I><B></B></I><I></I><I></I>
#25 by "Apache"
2000-06-02 21:22:30
apache@warzone.com http://www.voodooextreme.com
<quote>so we'll lowball Blue's and say he gets 2m a month, which is 65% of the total network traffic the gamefan sites get. and that's just one site that reports all the reviews, not just the positive ones. </quote>

your stats are wacky.
#26 by "Sgt Hulka"
2000-06-02 21:32:30
sgt_hulka@yahoo.com http://www.hulka.com
I can proudly declare I'm a Daikatana Virgin.  I've not played the demo, nor the full retail version.  Actually, I'm scared of it.  Can't quite put my finger on it, but something tells me, perhaps a ghost, yes that's it.  The ghost of a small girl who once lived in this house, but was murdered by neighborhood boys in the early 70's.  Her killers were never found. So now she spending her time between haunting this house and telling me which games to play, and which ones to be afraid of.  If you can't get reliable game reviews off the popular sites, you're going to need a ghost like I have.


I don't know her name since her voice can't travel to this dimension, so I just call her Madge.
#27 by "Darkseid"
2000-06-02 21:34:57
Darkseid-D@planetcrap.com http://www.captured.com/boomstick
green rocks, hes on green rocks


Jeet on the other hand has blue ones with a paisley pattern...




Ds<I><B></B></I><I></I><I></I>
#28 by "Apache"
2000-06-02 21:37:04
apache@warzone.com http://www.voodooextreme.com
A good place to get honest stats (kinda low, but everyone's are so it evens out) are the <A HREF="http://www.pcdataonline.com/reports/free/">PC Data Online Top Web Sites reports</a>.

The May edition is now up, in case you are interested.

tip - searching for sites in question, do a search with the 'contains' option.

btw- Monthly unique visitors are not a tally of daily traffic, but rather how many 'different' people hit the site per month.
#29 by "Steve Bauman"
2000-06-02 22:06:56
sbauman@adelphia.net http://homepages.together.net/~sbauman/
<quote>A good place to get honest stats (kinda low, but everyone's are so it evens out) are the PC Data Online Top Web Sites reports. </quote>
Wow, I didn't even know existed. Hey, we rank 2216, ahead of Voodoo Extreme at 9232 (heh heh). Oh, and GameFan at 4901. Not bad, since we have no network and don't advertise.
#30 by "Apache"
2000-06-02 22:10:18
apache@warzone.com http://www.voodooextreme.com
Steve: cdmag is a great site, I'm a regular reader myself :)

btw- here's an interesting <A HREF="http://www.zdnet.com/anchordesk/stories/story/0,10738,2580658,00.html">article</a> which talks about the most read gaming sites. (The winner was IGN with 2 million readers a month)
#31 by "crash"
2000-06-02 22:18:44
crash@planetcrap.com http://www.planetcrap.com
flamey:
<i>crash - Blue reports <b>some</b> reviews, not all.</i>

good point. modify my original statement accordingly. :)

Apache:
<i>your stats are wacky.</i>

yes, they are. i did everything but say they're outright guesses. :) using that site (whoa GC's at 551, and omg you're right it's kinda low) i can't judge blue's traffic cos he's not on there. ? or am i not searching right?
#32 by "Apache"
2000-06-02 22:51:56
apache@warzone.com http://www.voodooextreme.com
<quote>blue's traffic cos he's not on there. ? or am i not searching right? </quote>

they did not make the cut in May, so to speak. do a search in April's report.
#33 by "Steve Bauman"
2000-06-02 23:17:12
sbauman@adelphia.net http://homepages.together.net/~sbauman/
<quote>btw- here's an interesting article which talks about the most read gaming sites. (The winner was IGN with 2 million readers a month) </quote>
The advantage a lot of sites have (IGN, GameFan, Gamespot, Gamecenter) over a site like ours is that they cover console as well as PC games.  Of course their traffic will be higher; they're targetting more gamers. If they split their traffic (which wouldn't make much sense for them), you could make a more accurate comparison for PC sites versus console sites.
#34 by "Joost Schuur"
2000-06-02 23:20:48
jschuur@gamespy.com http://www.gamespy.com
VE: 9232
Stomped: 7122
GameFan: 4901
GameSpy.com: 3822

Yay! we win ;) Where do we pick up our prizes? I would throw Telefragged in there, but they have so many sites on the telefragged.com domain, that skews their numbers.



(This public outcry of jubilation does not represent the official warm fuzzies of GameSpy Industries as a whole)
#35 by "Apache"
2000-06-02 23:26:20
apache@warzone.com http://www.voodooextreme.com
<quote>Yay! we win</quote>

joost: you are l337 :) (check express.com though)

stomped must be living large with that gc alliance thing :)
#36 by "Slade"
2000-06-02 23:35:17
slade@telefragged.com http://www.telefragged.com
The numbers never lie:P

Telefragged.com: 3694  
VE: 9232
Stomped: 7122
GameFan: 4901
GameSpy.com: 3822
#37 by "Joost Schuur"
2000-06-02 23:36:31
jschuur@gamespy.com http://www.gamespy.com
Ahh, but E-Commerce related sites should _never_ be included in stats. Only content should count.

Slightly off topic, but how is this GameCenter Alliance thing being perceived by people a part of it? Too early to tell? Can we expect new sites to join it soon? I noticed they're not even listing how to contact them, so they must hand pick them themselves and approach others.

Crash, give us the scoop ;)
#38 by "Joost Schuur"
2000-06-02 23:40:49
jschuur@gamespy.com http://www.gamespy.com
Slade, these numbers are based on traffic to anything on each domain name. There is one public site on the gamespy.com domain name and that's produced by in house people at GameSpy or freelancers.

The telefragged.com domain name must house anywhere from 100 to a few hundred sites for properties that don't have their own domain name.

I'm using these figures not to compare gaming network size, but the impact various the main news and original content site behind each network is creating.

But hey... we don't know how truely accurate these numbers are anyway and stats can be interpreted a lot of ways, so let's all lighten up and just produce the best site(s) possible.
#39 by "Apache"
2000-06-02 23:42:17
apache@warzone.com http://www.voodooextreme.com
<quote>Ahh, but E-Commerce related sites should _never_ be included in stats. Only content should count. </quote>

True, but then you'd have to take away a bunch of readers for cdmag, since their bits-n-chips store is hosted under the same url. (Steve would get mad! ;)
#40 by "Joost Schuur"
2000-06-02 23:45:58
jschuur@gamespy.com http://www.gamespy.com
Hey, just to clarify: I'm not about to bring up a whole new thread on 'my network is better than your network' discussion here. All the key players here in this discussion have been doing what they do for a while now and obviously make a living at it and enjoy it and that's great. Numbers are really not a huge issue here, it's finding something you truely dig getting out of bed for in the morning.

Enough said.
#41 by "Andrew Stine"
2000-06-03 00:00:09
linguica@doomworld.com http://www.doomworld.com
We haven't had a good "my network is better than your network" flamewar on the Crap for a long time... vent that pent-up rage!  Heh.
#42 by "Paperchase"
2000-06-03 00:03:46
Eidos bought the pigslop that is Romero's Daikatana at the expense of the magnificent visions of Looking Glass; as a result, Eidos and Romero must now plaster the net with Daikatana propaganda, manipulate the media (did anyone ever check out the "which hero are you most looking forward to playing" poll on the Eidos website? Talk about altering statistics...), and beg for support via personal email in a pathetic attempt to create the illusion that their turd is a gold brick. I guess they have the right to do so, since Romero's probably got more bread than a prison meatloaf. It's sad to see Eidos stoop to such low ethical standards and insult gamers with such unabashed bullsquat.

However, just think of what this means to gamers who appreciate quality entertainment: <I>Gamers are now deprived of quality game selection from Eidos.</I> Although LG mismanaged their funds, Eidos could still have bailed them out if they had not poured money into Ion; now the selection is limited to a "founder" who can't manage a team nor create a game that's worth the work behind the customer's cash. I make roughly forty-five dollars an hour, and I eagerly fork out cash for a game by Looking Glass; however, I seriously wouldn't accept twenty bucks to have to write a review on the demo (not that I could anyway, but the game is <I>that bad</I>).

Eidos has blown their credibility as far as being a source of gaming information. I wouldn't believe anything they say or advertise. Someone posted earlier that <B>Bluesnews</B> is a better site for objective information, and I agree. Just look at the Daikatana box - the quote from PC Accelerator was taken sorely out of context (Look up the article on the Daily Radar) and exhibits a character that demands (at most) a chuckle of sarcastic pathos. Also, just peruse the Planet Daikatana message board; Mr. Gwog (whose dedication to the game over the last four years is remarkable and highly commendable) has banned any editorial-type disses of the game in favor of four or five twelve-year olds who would most likely kill for Romero. Some community...oh well, I guess game quality is synonymous with received audience.

Pity...the end of quality games is upon us. Thanks, Romero.
#43 by "crash"
2000-06-03 00:21:21
crash@planetcrap.com http://www.planetcrap.com
holy crap loony! what's up with that billboard sized UGO logo next to the bluesnews header? god DAMN that's obnoxious.
#44 by "Warren Marshall"
2000-06-03 00:48:33
warren@epicgames.com http://www.epicgames.com
Haha, you know i THOUGHT something was different when I went to Blue's today ... now I know what it was.  :)
#45 by "Jafd"
2000-06-03 01:12:43
jafd@whatthefuck.com http://www.therainforestsite.com/
<b>#44</b> "Warren Marshall" wrote...
<QUOTE>something was different when I went to Blue's today</QUOTE>

Jesus wept! Someone squeeze it, maybe it will pop!

MUCH rather have a pockmark than that outrageous icon<I><B></B></I><I></I><I></I>
#46 by "Jeremy"
2000-06-03 01:18:10
jnthornh@eos.ncsu.edu
<b>#37</b> "Joost Schuur" wrote...
<QUOTE>Ahh, but E-Commerce related sites should _never_ be included in stats. Only content should count. </QUOTE>
Hmm, if that's your logic, then why are you including gamespy.com?

(sorry, couldn't resist)

Jeremy<I><B></B></I><I></I><I></I>
#47 by "Pete Closs"
2000-06-03 01:30:23
<b>#43</b> "crash" wrote...
<QUOTE>holy crap loony! what's up with that billboard sized UGO logo next to the bluesnews header? god DAMN that's obnoxious. </QUOTE>

Is a tad over concpicuous isn't it.<I><B></B></I><I></I><I></I>
#48 by "crash"
2000-06-03 02:42:26
crash@planetcrap.com http://www.planetcrap.com
remember incite's daikatana review?

<a href="http://www.incite.com/incite/plsql/incite_main.main?right_menu_depth=0&left_menu_depth=0&in_id=11926&in_type=&in_platform=" target="_blank">they've got an update.</a>

for obvious reasons, i can't comment on this.
#49 by "Apache"
2000-06-03 03:21:10
apache@warzone.com http://www.voodooextreme.com
anyhow, to address this article. Eidos owns less than a 10 percent stake in us and has no editorial control over our writing. linking daikatana review # ten zillion on every site is pretty much of waste of time and space on the main page.

btw- my checks aren't late, maybe lowtax can inquire about the direct deposit program...  :)
#50 by "Steve Bauman"
2000-06-03 03:49:08
sbauman@adelphia.net http://homepages.together.net/~sbauman/
<quote>crash: hey've got an update. </quote>
Translation: "Oh, we rushed through it to be first, we're getting a lot of negative feedback, so we thought we'd try to save face a bit."

<quote>Apache: linking daikatana review # ten zillion on every site is pretty much of waste of time and space on the main page. </quote>
OK, then what about linking to multiple previews of the same game (I saw three Icewind Dale preview links today)?
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Web Links: [url=www.mans.de]Cool Site[/url], [url]www.mans.de[/url]
Email Links: [email=some@email.com]Email me[/email], [email]some@email.com[/email]
Simple formatting: Quoted text: [quote]Yadda yadda[/quote]
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