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T O P I C
Didn't we do this already?
January 7th 2002, 02:16 CET by Gabe

Well, we are about a week into 2002 and one thing I have noticed is that it isn't a whole lot different than 2001.

* PlanetCrap is still here.
* Duke Nukem Forever still isn't here.
* The Word That Will Go Unamed is still hated.
* Discussions of T.W.T.W.G.U. are still hated even more.
* Spam still sucks.
* Spammers still suck even more.
* The theory of two market leaders still holds.
* Except when it doesn't.
* Topics still aren't posted often enough.
* Topics still don't stay on topic.
* People still bitch about the previous two items.

Anything you would like to add? Predictions, observations, flames? That would still be the same, too.

Oh yeah:

* We all still need to get laid.
C O M M E N T S
Home » Topic: Didn't we do this already?

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#1 by "Warren Marshall"
2002-01-07 02:20:36
warren_AT_epicgames.com http://www.epicgames.com
* Most people are still ignorant of marketing concepts, but don't believe that they are.
#2 by "Bailey"
2002-01-07 02:20:41
In 2002, there are far more jalapeno poppers available to the general public. Rejoice.
#3 by "Gabe"
2002-01-07 02:30:49
gabe@opencrap.org http://www.opencrap.org
Warren reminded me of another one:

* Reading a book about something once still makes you an expert.
#4 by "jafd"
2002-01-07 02:37:28
kallisti@hell.com http://jafd.isfuckingbrilliant.com
Hrrrrm. Well, I feel like 2002 is a lot different so far; one year ago this week, everyone wasn't so much on the brink of violence, for one thing.

Personally, I've gotten a lot of productive changes in over the last two weeks, but I'm sure that doesn't matter much to anyone else.

* Capitalism is still the best system.
#5 by "Mad_Dog"
2002-01-07 02:38:39
Spam this http://www.opencrap.org
#0 Gabe
* Topics still aren't posted often enough.

I'm curious... what exactly is it you like to see in a user-summited topic? Any preferences/pet peeves? How many words; should it be a "Hey! Punkbusters does RTCW! Discuss." shortie, or is it better to be more article-like?

I ask because it seems there is no... standard, I guess. All we here is "We don't have enough topics, and the ones that are emailed in suck!"
#6 by "Leslie Nassar"
2002-01-07 02:39:38
http://www.leslienassar.com/
* We still don't have flying cars or robot maids.
#7 by "LPMiller"
2002-01-07 02:48:02
lpmiller@gotapex.com http://www.gotapex.com
#1 Warren Marshall
* Most people are still ignorant of marketing concepts, but don't believe that they are.


*The few that think they understand marketing, need to rub it in.
#8 by "m0nty"
2002-01-07 02:56:43
m0nty_au@yahoo.com.au no fixed abode
* Every topic Gabe writes is lame.
#9 by "Gabe"
2002-01-07 02:58:59
gabe@opencrap.org http://www.opencrap.org
m0nty reminded me of another one:

* Gabe still sucks.
#10 by "Leslie Nassar"
2002-01-07 03:03:25
http://www.leslienassar.com/
* Armchair game designers are still a pain in the ass.
#11 by "m0nty"
2002-01-07 03:03:28
m0nty_au@yahoo.com.au no fixed abode
* Every topic Gabe writes is lame.
#12 by "Gabe"
2002-01-07 03:08:41
gabe@opencrap.org http://www.opencrap.org
#5 by Mad_Dog
I'm curious... what exactly is it you like to see in a user-summited topic? Any preferences/pet peeves? How many words; should it be a "Hey! Punkbusters does RTCW! Discuss." shortie, or is it better to be more article-like?

I ask because it seems there is no... standard, I guess. All we here is "We don't have enough topics, and the ones that are emailed in suck!"

There aren't really any concrete guidelines. Short, one-line things mostly won't fly. That's what Bluesnews is for! Something that you have been thinking about that you think others would like to discuss might have a better chance. If it is interesting, and reasonably well written (comprehensible), it has a shot.

Here are some more examples of what not to submit:

Phisics
Any one Enjoy chating about phisics or want to inprove there knowledge come here ok i never done this before so sue me

JACK SHIT
Yo

where are the hacks
Where are all the hacks?if your on a hack home page wheres your hacks?Huh I dont get you guys.lol
#13 by "Gabe"
2002-01-07 03:10:02
gabe@opencrap.org http://www.opencrap.org
#8 by m0nty
* Every topic Gabe writes is lame.

#11 by m0nty
* Every topic Gabe writes is lame.

* Some Australians still have problems using the internet.
#14 by "m0nty"
2002-01-07 03:18:43
m0nty_au@yahoo.com.au no fixed abode
No, just using Linux on a 5-year-old modem.
#15 by "BabiG"
2002-01-07 03:19:27
* Most people are still ignorant of marketing concepts, but don't believe that they are.


Oh hey, who are the two people here who've made that claim? That they understand marketing? Or should I say, the "22 Immutable Laws of Marketing"?
#16 by "Warren Marshall"
2002-01-07 03:31:38
warren_AT_epicgames.com http://www.epicgames.com
Gabe
Warren reminded me of another one:

* Reading a book about something once still makes you an expert.

Excellent.  If you can show me the post where I claimed to be an expert, you win a cookie.

Oh wait ... yeah, that's right.  I believe I specifically stated, twice in fact, that I was NOT an expert.

But I've learned my lesson.  Reading books and gathering information is for pussies.  Shooting from the hip is the way to go.

BabiG
Oh hey, who are the two people here who've made that claim? That they understand marketing? Or should I say, the "22 Immutable Laws of Marketing"?

Oh, that would be Scott Miller and I.  But everyone else knows better, so it doesn't matter.


To change the subject ...

Just played the Medal of Honor SP demo.  TOTALLY awesome.  This game is going to kick ass, I can't wait for it now.  The MP demo was fairly blech, but the SP is killer.  Advancing through the bombed out city with your AI teammates is hella fun.
#17 by "Bailey"
2002-01-07 03:37:57
Warren

But I've learned my lesson. Reading books and gathering information is for pussies. Shooting from the hip is the way to go.

Worked for Clint Eastwood, didn't it?

Re: MoH demo

Mine won't load. Ever. I dunno, maybe I fugged around with the graphics too much, but even setting it to default, I get frozen every time. Therefore, I righteously and gracefully dub EA and 2015 incompetent. And I predict great failure. And syphillis. LOTS of syphillis in their futures.
#18 by "FunkDrunk"
2002-01-07 03:40:05
Oh, that would be Scott Miller and I. But everyone else knows better, so it doesn't matter.


I was going to say that I've read The 22 Imutable Laws of Marketing, Positioning, and I'm working on The 22 Imutable Laws of Branding...  and that I weakly tried to help defend those books, but then I realized that I would get gang raped, and after seeing you guys do it to Scott and Warren, I decided to keep my mouth closed....

Funk.
#19 by "Warren Marshall"
2002-01-07 03:41:01
warren_AT_epicgames.com http://www.epicgames.com
Bailey
Mine won't load. Ever. I dunno, maybe I fugged around with the graphics too much, but even setting it to default, I get frozen every time. Therefore, I righteously and gracefully dub EA and 2015 incompetent. And I predict great failure. And syphillis. LOTS of syphillis in their futures.

What error do you get?  Is it the "OpenGL subsystem cannot initialize" thing?  I got that at first too until I switched to an older video driver version, nvidia 21.81 ...
#20 by "Gabe"
2002-01-07 03:41:55
gabe@opencrap.org http://www.opencrap.org
#16 by Warren Marshall
Gabe
Warren reminded me of another one:

* Reading a book about something once still makes you an expert.

Excellent.  If you can show me the post where I claimed to be an expert, you win a cookie.

Oh wait ... yeah, that's right.  I believe I specifically stated, twice in fact, that I was NOT an expert.

But I've learned my lesson.  Reading books and gathering information is for pussies.  Shooting from the hip is the way to go.

Touchy touchy you gunslinger you.
#21 by "HoseWater"
2002-01-07 03:49:14
http://www.opencrap.org
Found something different from 2001.  Since this thread was added, opencrap has died on me three times.


-I was going to buy an Xbox, but one day my PC fell over, so I left it that way.
#22 by "Mad_Dog"
2002-01-07 03:56:54
Spam this http://www.opencrap.org
#21 HoseWater
Found something different from 2001.  Since this thread was added, opencrap has died on me three times

Strange... I've been seeing crashes as well. Access violation blah blah blah, right?
#23 by "Bailey"
2002-01-07 03:59:30
Warren

What error do you get? Is it the "OpenGL subsystem cannot initialize" thing? I got that at first too until I switched to an older video driver version, nvidia 21.81 ...

No error at all. The thing just hangs, plays music, and does nothing after I click the difficulty setting. The third time, I let it sit for a half-hour, still nothing.

Gabe

Touchy touchy you gunslinger you.

He probably remembers the face of his father, however.
#24 by "HoseWater"
2002-01-07 04:00:55
http://www.opencrap.org
#22 Mad_Dog
#21 HoseWater
Found something different from 2001.  Since this thread was added, opencrap has died on me three times

Strange... I've been seeing crashes as well. Access violation blah blah blah, right?


Yep, that's the one.

-I was going to buy an Xbox, but one day my PC fell over, so I left it that way.
#25 by "Matthew Gallant"
2002-01-07 04:01:51
mg@truemeaningoflife.com http://truemeaningoflife.com
You know what? I'm calling it:
Next year, same list. No changes.
#26 by "Gabe"
2002-01-07 04:02:32
gabe@opencrap.org http://www.opencrap.org
#24 by HoseWater
#22 Mad_Dog
#21 HoseWater
Found something different from 2001.  Since this thread was added, opencrap has died on me three times

Strange... I've been seeing crashes as well. Access violation blah blah blah, right?


Yep, that's the one.

-I was going to buy an Xbox, but one day my PC fell over, so I left it that way.

*cough*
#27 by "Evilash"
2002-01-07 04:09:35
evilash@eviladam.com
Change this "We all still need to get laid." to this..
                 "Warren still needs to get Laid."  And then I would agree 100% percent. ;)


Oh yeah.. I wonder when The crew from 3dr will apologize to the Croteam about the Serious SAm insults.  Considering Serious has a Game of the Year award under their belt.  And DNf has nothing.. cause 3dr hasn't released jack in 6 years.

Thats right. 6 years since the LASt duke title was released.  Its scary. Raven for example has released in the past 6 years..

Take No prisoners,NEcrodome,MageSlayer,Hexen2,Heretic2,Soldier of Fortune And Star Trek:Voyager Elite Force.

And now they have SOF2 do for release this year.. And JK.

And whats scary is.. There is no guarantee that.. Dnf is released this year.
And those crazy croteam guys are releasing Serious SAm2 in a few weeks.
I mean how much crow does 3dr have to eat before they admit maybe just maybe.. Somethings wrong with this SLOW as molasses development process they have.

And the when its done excuse.. Was started by id. but At least since 1996.. well id has released ahem several titles. unlike 3dr.  So its not like Id software uses "when its done to =
Maybe in your lifetime.  

I mean christ its already 2002.. over a half a decade since the first Duke3d fps. Isn't that a bit much?
#28 by "crash"
2002-01-07 04:13:31
* People still think signposts in a human-created arbitrary measurement of time should have some sort of meaning.
#29 by "None-1a"
2002-01-07 04:21:28
http://www.opencrap.org
#27 Evilash
And those crazy croteam guys are releasing Serious SAm2 in a few weeks.


You know just a minor quible but it's not tecnicly Serious Sam 2, since that would imply Serious Sam was the full game. Remember it was cut down to what would have been just the first episode of the game.
#30 by "Mad_Dog"
2002-01-07 04:22:54
Spam this http://www.opencrap.org
* People still give a damn about D4E, and STILL are pissed that it hasn't shipped yet.

When that thing hits the shelves, it'll sell like $500 prostitutes on thrifty nickel night.
#31 by "Bailey"
2002-01-07 04:26:51
Evilash

Take No prisoners,NEcrodome,MageSlayer,Hex...ier of Fortune And Star Trek:Voyager Elite Force.

Round these parts, we use spaces, pilgrim.

As for Soldier of Fortune and Elite Force, uh, I wouldn't be bragging about those accomplishments anytime soon. Sure, it's more games than I produced (read: zero) but they certainly weren't very impressive to my eyes. The length of EF, and the general craptitude of SoF (sole selling factor being the gore, as the brown quake levels, choppy attempt at a script and crummy models sure didn't cut it) make them non-scout badge material. As for those other games... never heard of 'em. Unless that one in there you butchered was Hexen/2.
#32 by "Warren Marshall"
2002-01-07 04:30:14
warren_AT_epicgames.com http://www.epicgames.com
Evilash
Change this "We all still need to get laid." to this..
"Warren still needs to get Laid." And then I would agree 100% percent. ;)

"needs"?  Why "needs"?

I could buy "might like to", but "needs"?

Thats right. 6 years since the LASt duke title was released. Its scary. Raven for example has released in the past 6 years..

Take No prisoners,NEcrodome,MageSlayer,Hex...ier of Fortune And Star Trek:Voyager Elite Force.

And now they have SOF2 do for release this year.. And JK.

And whats scary is.. There is no guarantee that.. Dnf is released this year.

What's scarier is that (I'll bet) Duke Nukem 3D has made more money than all of those Raven games put together.  There's something to be said for taking your time.

I mean how much crow does 3dr have to eat before they admit maybe just maybe.. Somethings wrong with this SLOW as molasses development process they have.

They can't really eat crow unless DNF comes out and sucks.  Until they ship something, everything you say is speculation.
#33 by "Evilash"
2002-01-07 04:36:24
evilash@eviladam.com
Sof was an excellent title. And Elite Force was the first Star Trek game That held people interests  which is saying alot. Considering 99.9% of star trek games Have sucked.

Your telling me ya never heard of Heretic 2? LOL Puhlease.

As far as Everyone rushing to get Dnf once it gets released.  Does the old saying What have you done for me lately ring a bell?  I mean There is NO guarantee that Dnf won't be an OKay title.

I mean it will have When it does finally GEt released alot of competition. Every month its not released new titles are coming out that Decrease the window of oppurtonity it will have.

And of course there are the unknowns.. The unknown A+ titles that can suprise folks. And do really well.. And cause folks to rethink.. why Should I care about  a title like Dnf?

Oh yeah MOH looks to be fantastic after playing the single player demo. But I know DNF is Supposed to BE THE BESTEST PERIOD. I mean how naive of me for not worshipping 3drealms for their "history" of ground-breaking work. Ahem.
#34 by "Eris"
2002-01-07 04:37:40
#2 by Bailey

Wrong-o. Burger King's wonderful cheddar cheesy (rather than cream-cheesy) take on them is no longer being served. Still for some UNGODLY reason they serve those mozzarella sticks that taste like an industrial waste byproduct.

#14 by m0nty

Obviously you have not dealt with any (win)modem built in the last 5 years. I miss my old ISA/External modems. Not too much, as I'm using dsl... but when i'm out of my house I do :P
#35 by "Evilash"
2002-01-07 04:39:32
evilash@eviladam.com
So whats more impressive?  having one good title.. OR having a large body of good work? Yeah I know. We can't hold 3dr to the standards a company like Blizzard keeps. I mean how many A-list titles have they released since 1996?  I know thats just unfair of me.  But I can list more examples. Why is it that 3dr doesn't get held to those standards but others have to?
#36 by "Dinglehoffen"
2002-01-07 04:50:15
FIRST POST!!!!!!!!

Suck it down!
#37 by "m0nty"
2002-01-07 04:51:14
m0nty_au@yahoo.com.au no fixed abode
I was watching The Third Man last night, thought by some critics to be the best movie ever made. It was certainly a good one, which I enjoyed a lot. It got me thinking though: it had a lot of dialogue with people talking a load of old toot in bars (spot the reference?), spiced with some chase scenes, secretive old Nazis, and a climactic scene in... a sewer! What more could you want for a PC game license than that? Forget Duke Nukem, I'd like to roleplay Orson Welles, dammit!
#38 by "Mad_Dog"
2002-01-07 04:59:55
Spam this http://www.opencrap.org
#35 Evilash
So whats more impressive?  having one good title.. OR having a large body of good work? Yeah I know. We can't hold 3dr to the standards a company like Blizzard keeps. I mean how many A-list titles have they released since 1996?  I know thats just unfair of me.  But I can list more examples. Why is it that 3dr doesn't get held to those standards but others have to?

I find it strange that you despise 3dr for dn4's lateness... yet you still seem to give a damn. Me, personally? I would have long ago screamed "Bastards, bastards, bastards! We hates it, we hates it, we hates it for ever!", or something like that.

You, like the other dn4/3dr complainers, seem to follow the game's continual delay daily. Which makes me think that you will be one of the sad loosers sitting on a store's doorstep at 5am, waiting to be the first to buy the game.  You have to, because no sane person would invest the time in slagging a hypothetical product unless they really, really wanted it.
#39 by "crash"
2002-01-07 05:02:20

Why is it that 3dr doesn't get held to those standards but others have to?

why do you give a shit? did they come to your house and slap you or something? so they haven't released a new game in six years. who cares? did you give them money or something? are you their publisher? do you have any sort of vested interest in it, other than as the pathetic bleatings of a jilted fanboy who thinks a company that made a game he liked SIX YEARS AGO somehow OWES him something?

please, do tell the audience how 3DRealms slipped into your house one night, fucked your mother, kicked your dog, emptied your fridge, and shit on your carpet. oh, wait? they didn't? why the bitterness? did they break up with you and tell you they wanted to be "just friends"?

good god. talk about needing to get laid.
#40 by "Matthew Gallant"
2002-01-07 05:02:38
mg@truemeaningoflife.com http://truemeaningoflife.com
ONE O DAMMIT!
#41 by "HoseWater"
2002-01-07 05:03:29
http://www.opencrap.org
#33 Evilash
Sof was an excellent title. And Elite Force was the first Star Trek game That held people interests  which is saying alot. Considering 99.9% of star trek games Have sucked.

Your telling me ya never heard of Heretic 2? LOL Puhlease.
I have, but I fail to see where you included that in your list.

As far as Everyone rushing to get Dnf once it gets released.  Does the old saying What have you done for me lately ring a bell?  I mean There is NO guarantee that Dnf won't be an OKay title.
So?

I mean it will have When it does finally GEt released alot of competition. Every month its not released new titles are coming out that Decrease the window of oppurtonity it will have.
You should send them an email, I bet they never thought of this. Wow.

And of course there are the unknowns.. The unknown A+ titles that can suprise folks. And do really well.. And cause folks to rethink.. why Should I care about  a title like Dnf?
You should not. They would probably prefer it if you did not buy or steal it.

Oh yeah MOH looks to be fantastic after playing the single player demo. But I know DNF is Supposed to BE THE BESTEST PERIOD. I mean how naive of me for not worshipping 3drealms for their "history" of ground-breaking work. Ahem.

Don't worship them, ignore them, they will let you know when it is time to check things out. They owe you nothing.

Quite frankly, this is one of the weakest anti 3DR rants I've ever seen.

-I was going to buy an Xbox, but one day my PC fell over, so I left it that way.
#42 by "Evilash"
2002-01-07 05:13:09
evilash@eviladam.com
Actually I this this the first time I have posted on its lateness. Ever. I just happened to notice that Duke3d had been released in Jan of 96 and now its jan of 2002 And the sequel stil hasn't been released.  

I don't know it just seemed kind of funny. Especially with the 3dr guys being So vocal about Dnfs apparent pre-destined greatness and their Apparent joy at ripping other products...While they themselves still have nothing AVailable to compare. But then again 3dr is totally innocent.
I am The Evil Anti-3dr fanboy. rrrrright.

Yeah I like having games get released that suck. I want all companies to do badly. and I hope they do badly. Heh.

Truth is I do hope that 3dr makes me eat crow. But I have a sneaky suspicion dnf will be like HAlo. over hyped and the reviews will treat it with kid gloves.
Mark it down. I doubt the media will treat Dnf to a higher standard.
#43 by "Warren Marshall"
2002-01-07 05:13:33
warren_AT_epicgames.com http://www.epicgames.com
Evilash
Sof was an excellent title. And Elite Force was the first Star Trek game That held people interests which is saying alot. Considering 99.9% of star trek games Have sucked.

Your telling me ya never heard of Heretic 2? LOL Puhlease.

"heard of" doesn't pay the bills.

So whats more impressive? having one good title.. OR having a large body of good work? Yeah I know. We can't hold 3dr to the standards a company like Blizzard keeps. I mean how many A-list titles have they released since 1996? I know thats just unfair of me. But I can list more examples. Why is it that 3dr doesn't get held to those standards but others have to?

How many employees does Blizzard have?  You expect 3DR to match Blizzards output?

And honestly, who gives a fuck?  If you hate them so much, don't talk about their game.  You're contributing to the buzz surrounding it.
#44 by "Warren Marshall"
2002-01-07 05:14:45
warren_AT_epicgames.com http://www.epicgames.com
I don't know it just seemed kind of funny. Especially with the 3dr guys being So vocal about Dnfs apparent pre-destined greatness and their Apparent joy at ripping other products...While they themselves still have nothing AVailable to compare. But then again 3dr is totally innocent.
I am The Evil Anti-3dr fanboy. rrrrright.

Is your shift key fucked up?
#45 by "Bailey"
2002-01-07 05:23:18
Evilash

Sof was an excellent title. And Elite Force was the first Star Trek game That held people interests which is saying alot.

Opinion, opinion, you're welcome to yours.

Your telling me ya never heard of Heretic 2? LOL Puhlease.

Hrm... well, I seem to recall something about switches opening doors, and standard guns masked as thrown melee weapons... Is that the one? Oh, and a catapult that launches sheep. Or something.

But to be honest, I've never played the game, though I think I watched someone play a demo once. Didn't catch my interest.
#46 by "m0nty"
2002-01-07 05:37:19
m0nty_au@yahoo.com.au no fixed abode
Hey EvilAsh, you and GeekGirl have something in common in liking Heretic 2. Nuff said.
#47 by "m0nty"
2002-01-07 05:37:29
m0nty_au@yahoo.com.au no fixed abode
Hey EvilAsh, you and GeekGirl have something in common in liking Heretic 2. Nuff said.
#48 by "m0nty"
2002-01-07 05:38:05
m0nty_au@yahoo.com.au no fixed abode
Damn Linux PC!  Grrrr.....
#49 by "BabiG"
2002-01-07 05:53:30
Heretic 2 was a great, underappreciated game.

Don't worship them, ignore them

I don't on A, and I wish I could on B, thier employees frequent 2/3 of all the forums I read, and the particpants can't get enough. However, I can. =)
#50 by "Matthew Gallant"
2002-01-07 06:09:18
mg@truemeaningoflife.com http://truemeaningoflife.com
I think the people who are complaining DNF coming up once again need to realize they spent a large amount of effort recently discussing irregardless.
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