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Gaming Site Deathmatch! Tonight: GSI vs. Beyond Unreal!
December 14th 2001, 15:16 CET by Morn

<i>And in the final days of PlanetCrap, on the 14th day of the 12th month of the year of bad WW2-themed shooters, Morn posted a topic about GameSpy, and a great many people suddenly stopped posting as the locusts descended upon the unsuspecting trolls.</i>

Just got this via email from 'Bob Doleman'.

Won't say who or where I work, but let's just say I know a lot about <a href="http://www.gamespyindustries.com">GSI</a> stuff.  As such, I'll speak in the third person:

GSI is a bit upset that they lost an important site/forum.  When the admins of <a href="http://www.beyondunreal.com">Beyond Unreal</a> left, they took with them the forums.  Now, Beyond Unreal claims they owned the license to the forum software and has every right to move it (in fact, one of the Beyond Unreal admins does explicitly own the license to the forum software).  GSI, says they actually owned it, because they supported the licensed forums with storage and bandwidth.  Also, since the forums used the name Planet Unreal, GSI believes they owned the software and contents.

Who is right and who is wrong.  Well, my sources tell me the admins at Beyond Unreal don't care.  They just want to continue and start off fresh.  My (other) sources also told me that GSI initially stated the same thing.  However, some new people at GSI are quite upset at the community for posting rants and raves about the imported forums.

So, they tasked some lawyers to look into who is right and who is wrong.  I also know that GSI is looking for evidence to pursue a criminal, not liable, charge against certain members of BU for moving the forums.

I wouldn't tell you this, but I am a bit distressed. All this is very trivial to the big picture.  GSI is actually going to try and sue a small site?  This will cause a mighty stir in the gaming industry.
C O M M E N T S
Home » Topic: Gaming Site Deathmatch! Tonight: GSI vs. Beyond Unreal!

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#1 by "Bailey"
2001-12-14 15:18:23
bailey@evilemail.com
I know a lot about GSI spam, myself.
#2 by "Theseus"
2001-12-14 15:21:25
not first
#3 by "Morn"
2001-12-14 15:27:04
morn@planetcrap.com http://www.planetcrap.com
For the record: this is an anonymous submission, so take it all with a big grain of salt. Even if it's true, I doubt it would "cause a mighty stir in the gaming industry". So don't panick! :-)
#4 by "The Punisher"
2001-12-14 15:29:19
mario_lowang@hotmail.com
off topic:

can someone here please help me...
i came thru singapore and got black thorn from there. it's rated M. there's no option in the game to turn on blood yet the manual talks about one. i have all other games in the series all with that option and blood...... ;-)

so when i play the game and kill a tango there's no blood AND their corpse dissapears after a few seconds. so i go looking in the registry for this game's settings and there's a "GoreOn" key (which i was aware from before) it's set to "FALSE" so i make it "TRUE" (which is the correct way).. i restart the game and still the same "PG" shit. i come back to the registry and the game reset it to "FALSE". WTF ?? any idea how it resets it ?? can i make that section in the registry not be ABLE to be midified ? any ideas ??? are all versions like this ?


thanks..
#5 by "Morn"
2001-12-14 15:29:56
morn@planetcrap.com http://www.planetcrap.com
However, even with my GSI bashing days being over and all, I enjoy every little poke into GSI's chest (or kick in the nuts. GSI's, not mine..). No offense, my GSI friends; maybe it will motivate you to stay a bit more focused. :)
#6 by "Cliff"
2001-12-14 15:40:12
cps46@earthlink.net
According to BeyondUnreal,
We moved the forums to another server when it became apparent that GSI was going to fracture the community by imposing ForumPlanet on PlanetUnreal. ForumPlanet is slower, less robust, has less functionality, has fewer administrative features, and the community at large has indicated to us that they'd rather stay with vBulletin.

I'm confused, or perhaps just ignorant:

1) If GSI was pushing ForumPlanet on them, why would they care about retaining/winning BeyondUnreal's forum software?
2) Isn't vBulletin generic bulletin board software belonging to neither party?
#7 by "Jeremy Witt"
2001-12-14 15:42:02
jeremywitt@evilemail.com
What's to say? I mean sure, GSI bad, small independent website good, but what is GSI to do? If they truly feel that they were wronged by BU, then of course they're going to sick the lawyers on them. If they don't, they set a precedent for avoiding persuit of people who take advantage of them.

Can BU use the PlanetUnreal name now, as they currently are?

Enh, the real story happens when a Flamethrower alias is asked to leave the Beyond Unreal forums, then comes here to cry about it.
#8 by "deadlock"
2001-12-14 15:48:06
dealdock@eircom.net
Cliff:
Isn't vBulletin generic bulletin board software belonging to neither party?

Yeah, probably, but according to the anonymous email, one of the Beyond Unreal admins owns the license for the software.

I've just realised out that Gunman Chronicles isn't called Gundam Chronicles as I have thought for the last, what ? Two years ?

deadlock

flamethrower hates my country...
#9 by "Bailey"
2001-12-14 15:52:53
bailey@evilemail.com
Punisher

off topic:

can someone here please help me...

You've already posted this last thread. Once is enough, trust me. If anyone knows or cares, they'll say something.

deadlock

Did the lack of giant robots finally tip you off?
#10 by "mgns"
2001-12-14 15:54:45
wratte@home.se
Well, if GSI is sending of their lawyers to dispatch of BU, they must very much think they have a case here. The bad karma they'd get if they lost such a legal battle would be quite huge, methinks.

---
scandahoovian chicks, get them while they're hot!
#11 by "deadlock"
2001-12-14 15:56:16
dealdock@eircom.net
Bailey:

Does that mean that there is a Gundam Chronicles ? Possibly about giant robots ? I'm confused and afraid. Help me Jebus!

deadlock

flamethrower hates my country...
#12 by "Judge Judas"
2001-12-14 16:04:06
JJ@planetcrap.com http://www.input-entertainment.de/laser/
Guess what!?

We have the all-new Stevie KILLCREEK Case in the form of Bernadette LaCarte

In an article crossing the inextricably linked worlds of game PR fluff and semi-naked "chick" developers, this absolutely awsome quote comes into play: "Just by virtue of being a woman, I contributed a lot to the game."

A picture of the young and attractive long-haired contributor is featured, she wears a hat and - possibly - a very small t-shirt hidden beheath tidal waves of brunette "Alannis Morissette" hair - but bonus points for the effect created by the acres of au-natural arm, neck, and chest flesh.


But daft bints aren't the be-all and end-all of the insanity, someone decided to include the lunchtime MINESWEEPER and SOLITAIRE playing secretaries into the gaming gene-pool: Figures show that women are increasingly playing video games. Around 43% of PC gamers and 35% of console game players are women, according to the Washington-based Interactive Digital Software Association.

Female gamers do not make up 43% of PC game sales or PC game hours played. A woman might "have a go" on her husbands machine, and the Hellchicks of this world prove the exception to the rule. And that's even if you count Myst AND Barbie.

I know lots of females play console games, but they don't make up a third. In a house with two males and two females the following approxmately happens: males buy PS2. males buy GTA3. males link PS2, GTA, and TV, together. males do not communicate to females for four days. one female goes to live with her mother. the other female takes a controler and agrees, for the sake of her relationship, to one mulitplayer race while one male is in the toliet pissing blood from having held his urine too long. the Washington-based acronym declares two thirds of console gamers are male, the rest are female.



Kind of like this juxtaposition, too:

The games industry has tried to address this issue by creating specific games designed to appeal to young girls. Many of these games come in pink or purple boxes and focus on activities such as shopping, fashion or dating. Many women resent the idea of games designed specifically for the female market. "I have a problem with pink games or what's called fluffware and that's games that are designed for the stereotypical interests of girls, you are lumping women in this category that is so ridiculous because women have a broad range of interests and you're losing a whole market by doing that. I play fighting games, I play shoot-em up games, I play them all. What men as well as women look for is interesting games, rich characters and storylines, immersive experiences, giant landscapes."

Unfortunately she fails to explain two things.

1. What part of a small blurry stick-figure isometrically angled on a white background performing approxminate 1% of the range and variety of animations found in a title like "Soul Calibur" equates to "a rich character", "storyline", "giant landscape", or even "interesting"?

2. For the kung-fu fighting, alien-killing, laser-blasting, player of EVERYTHING experts' opinions on what makes female gamers tick: why was this part of the article left unexplored?: "I was looking to create something I wanted to play," admitting that before she started work on SSX she rarely played games.

But then again, a man is hardly likely to say something NICE about a sister here on Planetcrap, eh? So would the 43% of Planetcrap readers who are female please - if they can get their pretty little heads to figure out how to start posting - make a pro-a-La-Carte post?
#13 by "Cliff"
2001-12-14 16:05:13
cps46@earthlink.net
deadlock #8
Cliff:
Isn't vBulletin generic bulletin board software belonging to neither party?

Yeah, probably, but according to the anonymous email, one of the Beyond Unreal admins owns the license for the software.

Oh.  Uhm, that would put me in my unnamed 3rd category, failing to read.  Which doesn't rule out the possibility that I'm also confused and/or ignorant.
#14 by "Cliff"
2001-12-14 16:13:39
cps46@earthlink.net
Judge Judas #12
Hahaha.  I did a quick search and turned up this tidbit from something called \"technology with curves\" (not, apparently, a site dedicated to the ins and outs of dynamic spline based tesselation):
Like most of us, she wasn't exactly sure what kind of work her arts degree and diverse work experience had prepared her for. She'd always wanted a job that would allow her either to travel to her heart's content or to get paid big bucks to draw pretty pictures.

Like most of...who?
#15 by "Bailey"
2001-12-14 16:27:44
bailey@evilemail.com
deadlock

Does that mean that there is a Gundam Chronicles ? Possibly about giant robots ? I'm confused and afraid. Help me Jebus!

Eh, I'm the wrong person to ask, these giant-robot animes are all goofy to me. But I believe I heard there was a Gundam MMOG in development, which will probably only confuse you more, but hey, I'm sadistic.
#16 by "wizard"
2001-12-14 17:17:30
wizardque@yahoo.com http://www.opencrap.org
#12 Judge Judas
A picture of the young and attractive long-haired contributor is featured, she wears a hat and - possibly - a very small t-shirt hidden beheath tidal waves of brunette "Alannis Morissette" hair - but bonus points for the effect created by the acres of au-natural arm, neck, and chest flesh.

You may need help...  Try this, get a girl friend...spend less time fantasizing about random women online.  :)

As for the rest of it...you really need help.  You talk about dysfunctional relationships, exposes they should have done, etc...  you read a lot into a simple, small article.

Go with this, it's just an article, it's just a simple talk about women playing SSX and then games in general with one of the creators of SSX...you've blown things way out of proportion here.
-wizard
#17 by "Battle-Dwarf"
2001-12-14 17:23:10
Planetcrap... The Web pages of Outrageous
I have reason to believe Judge Judas is pretending to be someone else.
I'm linking the word usage, diction and attitude to a certain individual we all know with a slight case of paranoia schizophrenia.


The Male Battle-Dwarf
#18 by "Cliff"
2001-12-14 17:33:32
cps46@earthlink.net
Battle-Dwarf #17
I have reason to believe Judge Judas is pretending to be someone else.
I'm linking the word usage, diction and attitude to a certain individual we all know with a slight case of paranoia schizophrenia.

Hmmm...the fancy talk and frankly excessive use of formatting tags would lead me to suspect jafd, if I had to suspect someone.  Wouldn't characterise it (jafd) as paranoid schizophrenic though; although I wasn't around in early crap days, from comments here that would be Andy.
#19 by "deadlock"
2001-12-14 17:35:59
dealdock@eircom.net
excessive use of formatting tags would make me think it's flamey. but he hasn't mentioned the Irish Conspiracy yet, or called anyone a cunt, so I don't think it's him.

deadlock

flamethrower hates my country...
#20 by "Darkseid-[D!]"
2001-12-14 17:39:50
Darkseid@Captured.com www.sluggy.com
ramtin ? have you come home ?


shall I have someone else call daddy again ?



Ds
#21 by "Jeremy Witt"
2001-12-14 17:42:36
jeremywitt@evilemail.com
Um, am I the only one who was actually able to match the IP 212.206.181.97 to flamethrowers? Of course it's him.
#22 by "mrbloo"
2001-12-14 17:49:01
mrbloo2000@hotmail.com
It's a softer, kinder Flamey for the new millennium!
#23 by "Cliff"
2001-12-14 17:50:54
cps46@earthlink.net
Jeremy Witt #21
Um, am I the only one who was actually able to match the IP 212.206.181.97 to flamethrowers? Of course it's him.

Apparently you're the only one who cared enough to check, but here: nice catch.
#24 by "Jeremy Witt"
2001-12-14 17:53:21
jeremywitt@evilemail.com
Apparently you're the only one who cared enough to check

What can I say, I love my job.
#25 by "Caryn Law"
2001-12-14 17:58:53
carynlaw@pacbell.net
Yeah, yeah, I know I'm probably wasting my time here, but why not. :)

#12 Judge Judas

We have the all-new Stevie KILLCREEK Case in the form of Bernadette LaCarte


I think it's unfair to characterize her as an "all-new Killcreek". We all know Killcreek's road to to the game developer life and many people view it as questionable, but you don't know La Carte's history. For all you know, she could have a long list of successful game titles under her belt.


In an article crossing the inextricably linked worlds of game PR fluff and semi-naked "chick" developers, this absolutely awsome quote comes into play: "Just by virtue of being a woman, I contributed a lot to the game."


I don't know anymore about this article that anyone else does, but I'm guessing that she had more to say after that quote and was cut off due to space -- or at least, that's my hope, because this is a terrible stand-alone quote. My total GUESS is that she went on to say that women can offer creative input from a different perspective than men can, and I don't think it's outrageous to say that. Anyone here who has a girlfriend or a wife can probably vouch for that -- they don't think like you do, do they? I know a male programmer who found that he very much valued having a few female programmers on his team because women programmers, he said, approach problems and solutions in a different way than men do, and the combination of the two made for very successful projects.


A picture of the young and attractive long-haired contributor is featured, she wears a hat and - possibly - a very small t-shirt hidden beheath tidal waves of brunette "Alannis Morissette" hair - but bonus points for the effect created by the acres of au-natural arm, neck, and chest flesh.


Dude, if you find that picture as an attempt at sexual appeal, you need to get out more.


Female gamers do not make up 43% of PC game sales or PC game hours played. A woman might "have a go" on her husbands machine, and the Hellchicks of this world prove the exception to the rule. And that's even if you count Myst AND Barbie.


You don't play MMORPGs, do you? How about Rollercoaster Tycoon? The Sims? Your statements suggest that you're only considering games like GTA3, which you use as an example below.


Kind of like this juxtaposition, too:


1. What part of a small blurry stick-figure isometrically angled on a white background performing approxminate 1% of the range and variety of animations found in a title like "Soul Calibur" equates to "a rich character", "storyline", "giant landscape", or even "interesting"?


Yeah, she was ONLY talking about Soul Calibur. Because we all know that there are NO games that she might have played aside from Soul Calibur that have rich characters, story lines, giant landscapes, or are interesting.


But then again, a man is hardly likely to say something NICE about a sister here on Planetcrap, eh? So would the 43% of Planetcrap readers who are female please - if they can get their pretty little heads to figure out how to start posting - make a pro-a-La-Carte post?


PC is a hardcore gaming crowd. Women do not likely make up 43% of the HARDCORE crowd. It's perfectly believable that they do make up 43% of the general gaming market.

All in all, I think your post was pretty short-sighted.
#26 by "deadlock"
2001-12-14 18:14:14
dealdock@eircom.net
Jeremy Witt:
Um, am I the only one who was actually able to match the IP 212.206.181.97 to flamethrowers? Of course it's him.

dunno, but you're probably the only person that could be bothered :P What's life without a little pointless speculation, huh ?

deadlock

flamethrower probably still hates my country...
#27 by "Jeremy Witt"
2001-12-14 18:20:01
jeremywitt@evilemail.com
Maybe I just have the host/IP of every single poster here memorized. Just maybe.
#28 by "mrbloo"
2001-12-14 18:28:28
mrbloo2000@hotmail.com
#27, Jeremy Witt

Maybe I just have the host/IP of every single poster here memorized. Just maybe.


God help us if you ever decide to use that power for Evil :)
#29 by "FunkDrunk"
2001-12-14 18:47:21
jflavius@bellatlantic.net
deadlock

Hey, shouldn't you change your sig to read, "Judge Judas probably still hates my country..."?

Funk.
#30 by "BATTLE-D_W_A_R_F"
2001-12-14 18:58:54
The web pages of outrageous... Planetcrap
Quote:
[Hey, shouldn't you change your sig to read, "Judge Judas probably still hates my country...]


Heh.





heh. heh.


The Male Battle-D
#31 by "Duality"
2001-12-14 19:08:11
Duality@neo-tokyo.org http://urf.gq.nu/
#11 deadlock
Bailey:

Does that mean that there is a Gundam Chronicles ? Possibly about giant robots ? I'm confused and afraid. Help me Jebus!

deadlock

flamethrower hates my country...

Its not a Gundam Chronicles game ... but someone showed me this site called UniversalCentury.net.  As beautiful and becoming as it is, I fear it will become a victim of Bandai licensing.

-Duality
A leopard can't change his spots ... oh wait!  He just did!  Good for him!
#32 by "Bailey"
2001-12-14 19:27:01
bailey@evilemail.com
(best Ralph Wiggum voice) I'm belligerant!

Caryn

I think it's unfair to characterize her as an "all-new Killcreek". We all know Killcreek's road to to the game developer life and many people view it as questionable, but you don't know La Carte's history. For all you know, she could have a long list of successful game titles under her belt.

Wasn't there some mention how she didn't play games much before she started working on this title? I get the impression it's her first, but I might be mistaken.

I know a male programmer who found that he very much valued having a few female programmers on his team because women programmers, he said, approach problems and solutions in a different way than men do, and the combination of the two made for very successful projects.

And having the breasts around the office doesn't hurt either. Ow! OW! Stop hitting me!

Dude, if you find that picture as an attempt at sexual appeal, you need to get out more.

No joke. That hat is an embarrassing throwback to the late 80s/early 90s Blossom-esque fashion trend. All she needs is some brightly-colored plastic charm bracelets. And the Alannis hair? Puh-LEEZ sister. (snapping fingers sassily in Z movement) So very 1999.

Yeah, she was ONLY talking about Soul Calibur. Because we all know that there are NO games that she might have played aside from Soul Calibur that have rich characters, story lines, giant landscapes, or are interesting.

Soul Calibur had who with the what now? I always thought it was fairly vapid fighting game with nice moves and shiny pictures. Not as vapid as some, but certainly not an epic story that will span millenia.

PC is a hardcore gaming crowd. Women do not likely make up 43% of the HARDCORE crowd. It's perfectly believable that they do make up 43% of the general gaming market.

Backing up Caryn on this issue. Statistics in the past have pointed to certain games and genres appealing to the fairer sex, genres, by and large, which do not include Quake or GTA3. Not to say women don't enjoy those games, but generally speaking, boys are raised on violent games and girls on establishing form and structure, such as Sims, Tycoon franchises, and yes, MMOGs contain.

Of course, most anyone you meet in a MMOG is a tranny, so if you want to meet a girl online, try hitting on the guys! Hilarity, if not steamy love, will ensue.
#33 by "None-1a"
2001-12-14 19:28:43
http://www.opencrap.org
#12 Judge Judas
Figures show that women are increasingly playing video games. Around 43% of PC gamers and 35% of console game players are women, according to the Washington-based Interactive Digital Software Association.


I've seen those studies before (and acctauly higher numbers in the 53-56% range). They include registration info from The Zone and other places. Sites that include card and puzzle games and a chat room attract quite a large number of women bloating the numbers.

#27 Jeremy Witt
Maybe I just have the host/IP of every single poster here memorized. Just maybe.


/me hopes you don't remember the days when @home posted his system name rather then proxy.
#34 by "Cliff"
2001-12-14 19:40:23
cps46@earthlink.net
Bailey #32
Of course, most anyone you meet in a MMOG is a tranny, so if you want to meet a girl online, try hitting on the guys! Hilarity, if not steamy love, will ensue.

So my best bet be to look for well-color-coordinated male characters, then?
#35 by "Caryn Law"
2001-12-14 19:43:22
carynlaw@pacbell.net
#32 Bailey
Wasn't there some mention how she didn't play games much before she started working on this title? I get the impression it's her first, but I might be mistaken.


Yes, but we still don't know anything about what she did prior to this title. For example, maybe she worked for game publishers but just didn't play the games? My point is that classifying her as "another Killcreek" is unfair given that you don't know anything about how she got where she is.


Soul Calibur had who with the what now? I always thought it was fairly vapid fighting game with nice moves and shiny pictures. Not as vapid as some, but certainly not an epic story that will span millenia.


I didn't mean to imply that SC has that. What I meant was that Flamethrower, or whoever he is, implied that SHE meant SC had all those, assuming that she didn't play any other games than SC, which clearly wasn't what she meant at all.


Backing up Caryn on this issue. Statistics in the past have pointed to certain games and genres appealing to the fairer sex, genres, by and large, which do not include Quake or GTA3. Not to say women don't enjoy those games, but generally speaking, boys are raised on violent games and girls on establishing form and structure, such as Sims, Tycoon franchises, and yes, MMOGs contain.


Exactly, and if you take a snapshot of the ten bestselling games in, say, the last year or two, what's topping the charts? Games like The Sims and the Tycoon games (yes, bloody shooters are there, too, but they don't dominate the charts).

None-1a has a point when he says that many times these figures factor in online card and puzzle gamers. Even if we were to throw those numbers out and say they're not "real" gamers, I still think that the percentages of women playing games is pretty big since we've got games that DO appeal to them on the market.

This is why I don't really understand the constant cry I'm seeing lately that there are no games for girls. It seems to me that there are plenty of games that should appeal to both genders -- DAoC certainly does, the Tycoon games do, The Sims definitely does. None of these games are "pink games" or insult women's intelligence, and they're among some of the best selling games right now.

So what's the problem? Are these games not appealing enough? And if so, what's the answer? Every time someone says that the current list of titles on the market isn't "women-friendly" (and I've got my own thoughts on how silly that term is), they never come up with suggestions as to what kind of games should be made to address this issue. All they do is throw their hands up and say that whatever it is, these games aren't it. Well if the issue concerns you that much, why should developers know the answer when you don't? Meanwhile, the women making up the 43% are probably happily playing games, not caring about the debate.
#36 by "chris"
2001-12-14 20:05:05
cwb@shaithis.com http://www.shaithis.com
For the record:

Whoever the hell Bob Doleman is, the stuff he's saying is totally inaccurate. There are no lawyers. We're not on a holy war... we're running a business. We don't really care what sites other than our own, and our hosted sites, choose to do.

Maybe the Beyond Unreal guys are looking for some publicity?

-chris
#37 by "Creole Ned"
2001-12-14 20:11:55
cned@telus.net
On the main story: Beyond Unreal doesn't use the Planet Unreal name. They use, er...Beyond Unreal. Since BU uses vBulletin and PU uses ForumPlanet, I don't see where GSI would have a case in going after them. Do they want all those old posts back? :P

I think it's hilarious how quickly Flamethrower's mask was pulled off. Of course, he'll claim that he was not smurfing, anyway.

In their recent PR puffery, Infogrames trumpeted the fact that since it was released in 1999, Rollercoaster Tycoon has been out of the top ten sales for only one week. If that's true, it's amazing. Between it and The Sims, that's where gaming's real success has been the last two years. The casual gamer rules. NPD sales ending December 1 (shamelessly cribbed from VE):

1) Harry Potter & The Sorcerer's Stone; Electronic Arts - $28
2) The Sims: Hot Date Expansion Pack; Electronic Arts - $29
3) The Sims; Electronic Arts - $40
4) Backyard Basketball; Infogrames Entertainment - $19
5) Survivor: The Interactive Game; Infogrames Entertainment - $17
6) MP Roller Coaster Tycoon; Infogrames Entertainment - $20
7) Return To Castle Wolfenstein; Activision - $56
8) MS Zoo Tycoon; Microsoft - $25
9) MP Civilization 3; Infogrames Entertainment - $45
10) Backyard Football 2002; Infogrames Entertainment - $20
#38 by "Caryn Law"
2001-12-14 20:17:48
carynlaw@pacbell.net
#37 Creole Ned

1) Harry Potter & The Sorcerer's Stone; Electronic Arts - $28
2) The Sims: Hot Date Expansion Pack; Electronic Arts - $29
3) The Sims; Electronic Arts - $40
4) Backyard Basketball; Infogrames Entertainment - $19
5) Survivor: The Interactive Game; Infogrames Entertainment - $17
6) MP Roller Coaster Tycoon; Infogrames Entertainment - $20
7) Return To Castle Wolfenstein; Activision - $56
8) MS Zoo Tycoon; Microsoft - $25
9) MP Civilization 3; Infogrames Entertainment - $45
10) Backyard Football 2002; Infogrames Entertainment - $20


And there isn't one single reason why the majority of these games shouldn't appeal to girls. And there are lots of games not on this list that should appeal to girls: Pikmin, Luigi's Mansion, Super Monkeyball...the list goes on.

I think that those complaining that there are no games for girls on the marketing are misguided in their criticism. The problem, I think, is not a lack of games, but in girls being discouraged (or not encouraged, something different) from playing video games. Perhaps most parents don't think that video games are "right" for girls to play. Those girls then grow up thinking that video games aren't something they'll be interested in, so they won't even pick up a controller even if the game might be something they'd like. If there's anything to address, that would be it.
#39 by "Bailey"
2001-12-14 20:26:01
bailey@evilemail.com
Cliff

So my best bet be to look for well-color-coordinated male characters, then?

If you're going to take that route, you might as well skip the MMOG and message me now, hot stuff.

Rule of thumb: if a female character uses LOTS of feminine self-descriptions, s/he's trying to reinforce the gender image. Usually male. If s/he is overly affectionate, huggles, LOLs, emotes constantly, and giggles incessently at everything, it's either a chubby 14-yr old female with lots of cats, or a guy trying to score da phat lewtz. If they offer to cyber, it's a 12 to 30-yr old male with gender confusion issues.

Realistic bet is to look for gals at LAN parties or shopping at EB who are enthusiastically buying a game. Odds are it's not a gift. But I think at that point you're trying way too hard to find a female who's mutually interested in games.

Sad thing is, every female I've met online and confirmed gender-wise in real life had lots and lots of personal problems and issues from childhood trauma. The majority of people who reach out for a relationship online are usually seeking to deal with internal issues in a safe, anonymous environment. And most everything goes to hell when they extend themselves a little too far.

Caryn

Yes, but we still don't know anything about what she did prior to this title. For example, maybe she worked for game publishers but just didn't play the games? My point is that classifying her as "another Killcreek" is unfair given that you don't know anything about how she got where she is.

Mm. Regardless of whatever talent Killcreek might have, which I have yet to see clearly displayed or associated with her, her tragic conversion from actually cute geek girl to bland plastic trophy girlfriend (Romero's charming comment about how having sex with her was akin to screwing a pinup/porn star reinforces this angle) is one which will haunt her forever, I imagine. Adversely, I know nothing of this SSX Tricky girl, and were it not for that ridiculous one-line quote (and we all know how the media likes to take things out of context to create a more interesting article) we probably would never have heard of her.

Meanwhile, the women making up the 43% are probably happily playing games, not caring about the debate.

As usual, the outspoken ones are comprising a very niche, very hardcore community, some who just enjoy bitching for the sake of having a banner to rally under. A good example of a non-gender related version of this is the DAoC detractors. Lacking real problems with the game, other than it being EQ sans suckage, they just made up problems as they went along, or called Mythic hacks for minor graphical errors. Bitching because it's cool, which makes me wonder if Lum notices the irony in this, since he was one of those who pioneered the gaming rant scene, and now is on the receiving end. Though to his credit, he preferred to work with real issues rather than contrived or cosmetic ones, his fans and emulators are largely incapable of acknowledging or realizing this.

The point is, it doesn't matter what you give some people, they won't be satisfied. Give them a working game, there's not enough content. Give them content, the classes aren't balanced. Give them balance, the game is boring and static. Non-gender focused games don't cater to the "Average Female", and female-targetted games are "pink". What they refuse to admit is that they are not the average female, and not representative of the larger mass. Repeat ad infinitum. They're (in general) very loud, very empty individuals, and should be treated as the cranks they are.

Valid complaints, I find, are few and far between, and most often, blatantly obvious to the most dull-minded of gamers. Preaching to the congregation.
#40 by "Ryan Kelly"
2001-12-14 20:30:21
kelster@planettribes.com http://www.planettribes.com/
I have three sisters who love gaming, despite my parents' attempts to keep them from turning into another me. They'd found my old SNES and hooked themselves to Zelda, Street Fighter II and Mario. Made me proud. :)

-Kel
#41 by "Battle-dwarf"
2001-12-14 20:33:05
web pages of outrageous PLANETCRAP
Quote:
[None of these games are "pink games" or insult women's intelligence, and they're among some of the best selling games right now.]


I wanna girl with game extentions in her hair
memory cards, at least two pair
competitive style with a bad attitude
that's all I need to keep me in a good mood
She can hang with her friends
and talk with 733t slang
I like a girl who ain't afraid to do her thang...


you know the rest...   ;)


the male battle-dwarf
#42 by "Bailey"
2001-12-14 20:38:30
bailey@evilemail.com
Ryan

I have three sisters who love gaming, despite my parents' attempts to keep them from turning into another me.

Heh, I love these stories... I got my 6-yr old nephew playing Half-Life like a badass, drives his mother absolutely insane. The GBA I bought him for his birthday didn't help.
#43 by "Caryn Law"
2001-12-14 20:43:40
carynlaw@pacbell.net
#42 Bailey

Heh, I love these stories... I got my 6-yr old nephew playing Half-Life like a badass, drives his mother absolutely insane. The GBA I bought him for his birthday didn't help.


We don't have kids yet, but I imagine that when we do, video games will be part and parcel with their lives.

Speaking the GBA, I'm loving mine. I took it on a plane trip recently. A friend was traveling with me to the same place so he brought his. We brought DOOM with us and sat in the seats on the plane near the emergency exit where you sit across from each other. As we were playing, it was all I could do to keep from shouting, "I've got the shotgun! I'M COMIN' FOR YOU, BITCH!"

Then I realized that an airplane was not the best place to be shouting that.
#44 by "LPMiller"
2001-12-14 20:48:30
lpmiller@gotapex.com http://www.gotapex.com
#43 Caryn Law
#42 Bailey

Heh, I love these stories... I got my 6-yr old nephew playing Half-Life like a badass, drives his mother absolutely insane. The GBA I bought him for his birthday didn't help.


We don't have kids yet, but I imagine that when we do, video games will be part and parcel with their lives.

Speaking the GBA, I'm loving mine. I took it on a plane trip recently. A friend was traveling with me to the same place so he brought his. We brought DOOM with us and sat in the seats on the plane near the emergency exit where you sit across from each other. As we were playing, it was all I could do to keep from shouting, "I've got the shotgun! I'M COMIN' FOR YOU, BITCH!"

Then I realized that an airplane was not the best place to be shouting that.


Good lord, in one fell swoop you would cause the media to go into an orgasmic frenzy, as the come to the realization that Terrorism and Doom are somehow interrelated.  Thank god you didn't say that.
#45 by "Bailey"
2001-12-14 21:07:20
bailey@evilemail.com
I haven't really played the game enough yet to be entirely sure what I think of it, but it seems to be a mixed bag.

-Maarten Goldstein, Global Ops beta preview

One more to add to the list.
#46 by "JMCDaveL"
2001-12-14 21:12:23
jmcdavel@mailandnews.com
How dare you train yourself to commit terrorist actions with that murder simulator Caryn!

--jmc
#47 by "Duality"
2001-12-14 21:16:18
Duality@neo-tokyo.org http://urf.gq.nu/
#44 LPMiller
Good lord, in one fell swoop you would cause the media to go into an orgasmic frenzy, as the come to the realization that Terrorism and Doom are somehow interrelated.  Thank god you didn't say that.

Why?  She could do a Darva Konger (sp?) type thing and use the media outlet to break her foot porn career.  And then the presidency!

-Duality
A leopard can't change his spots ... oh wait!  He just did!  Good for him!
#48 by "Cliff"
2001-12-14 21:32:27
cps46@earthlink.net
Bailey #39
If they offer to cyber, it's a 12 to 30-yr old male with gender confusion issues.

Or one of the fine lads from baiting.org.
#49 by "Caryn Law"
2001-12-14 21:39:56
carynlaw@pacbell.net
#47 Duality

Why?  She could do a Darva Konger (sp?) type thing and use the media outlet to break her foot porn career.  And then the presidency!


See, it just sounds so easy when you lay it all out like that.
#50 by "mgns"
2001-12-14 21:44:51
wratte@home.se
#39 Bailey
(Romero's charming comment about how having sex with her was akin to screwing a pinup/porn star reinforces this angle)

He really said that? Nice compliment, guess who's sleeping on the couch again... Got a link for that statement?

---
scandahoovian chicks, get them while they're hot!
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