PlanetCrap 6.0!
Front Page (ATOM) • Submission Bin (2) • ArchivesUsersLoginCreate Account
You are currently not logged in.
T O P I C
Here's your monthly AO-related topic
December 11th 2001, 02:27 CET by Morn

From Blue's:

<a href="http://www.ao-basher.com/mem_show_longmessage.php?memlongid=625">AO Basher</a> has a report up that there have been 30 layoffs at the Norwegian headquarters of Funcom, while a follow-up on <a href="http://www.homelanfed.com/index.php?id=3583">HomeLan Fed</a> confirms that this is indeed the case, while clarifying that in Norway layoffs mean that those laid off still receive 80% of their salaries, and are expected to return to work soon. They also follow-up that because they are focusing all their attention at the moment on Anarchy Online, this news also means that Midgard, their other planned MMORPG, is on hold, "but definitely not cancelled."

Discuss!
C O M M E N T S
Home » Topic: Here's your monthly AO-related topic

|«« - Previous Page - Next Page - »»|
#1 by "shaithis"
2001-12-11 02:39:03
cwb@shaithis.com http://www.shaithis.com
No real surprise. You have to have users that stick around for more than a month to make any real cash. :P

-shai
#2 by "The Joker"
2001-12-11 02:44:31
morn@planetcrap.com http://www.jackinworld.com
AO sucks. Morn sucks.

Joker, Phd. Procedural Assholian Behaviour, Pedophilosopher
- All your ass are belong to my wang Jafd. Prepare to are penetration.
#3 by "crash"
2001-12-11 02:54:05
crash@dork.com
* lies about the subscriber base size.

* begging publications not to review the product until it was fixed.

* saying it was playable and beginning billing when it clearly was not ready.

* game-breaking changes three months into the game.

* hiring an outside firm to tell them how to adminster it.

* a gestapo-like messageboard lockdown (which ironically did more damage than it solved).

* a patch list that looks like a "to-do" list for an alpha product.

* design flaws buried so deep in the game even the lead designer is asking players, "What should we do?"

* a monthly subscription fee higher than anything so far.

* customer service that barely deserves the name.

* a free month for cancelled accounts six months post-release. "PLEASE COME BACK WE NEED YOU" tactics. (has any other game ever done this? i don't recall any.)

* a game that has been patched to the tune of 31MB worth of code changes and fixes (nearly no new content, remember), a memory leak that still exists, game balance issues that are still outstanding, a haphazard and inconsistent attitude and policy towards exploits and exploiters, their largest "fan site" is actually hosted on Funcom's servers, for chrissakes... and as i write this, 40% of the game's zones are offline.

yeah, i can't imagine why they aren't rolling in money. i'm personally kind of surprised they've made it as long as they did. and in a slice of supreme irony, i've had it installed and idling at work for the past two hours and it hasn't crashed yet. usually it'd dump in less than a half hour.

poor, poor Funcom.
#4 by "Sgt Hulka"
2001-12-11 03:08:42
sgt_hulka@yahoo.com Lost_In_CyberSpace
As I sip from my Burger King light up Lord of the Rings Goblet (The Frodo one) I say unto thee, "Burn all MMORPGs!  Burn them all I say!"



...... I am the original +12 Extra Value Meal
#5 by "The Joker"
2001-12-11 03:10:54
morn@planetcrap.com http://www.jackinworld.com
#4 Sgt Hulka
As I sip from my Burger King light up Lord of the Rings Goblet (The Frodo one) I say unto thee, "Burn all MMORPGs!  Burn them all I say!"...... I am the original +12 Extra Value Meal


Hulka has it ever occured to you that you perhaps need help?

Joker, Phd. Procedural Assholian Behaviour, Pedophilosopher
- All your ass are belong to my wang Jafd. Prepare to are penetration.
#6 by "FunkDrunk"
2001-12-11 03:11:17
The sad thing is that Funcom made some decent adventure games once.  But apparently, they took themselves away from their core compentencies, and now they have to pay the price for it.

Should'a stayed with what they knew.


And if Woody had gone right to the police this would never have happened.

Funk.
#7 by "Scrozzy"
2001-12-11 03:21:12
scrozzy@bigfoot.com
hmm. 'tis a good game underneath. you just have to consciously keep telling yourself out loud that it's a good game every 2 minutes in order to convince yourself it's worth playing.
#8 by "HoseWater"
2001-12-11 03:34:23
http://www.opencrap.org
What to say...At least they are trying.  I don't think I've seen a company try as hard as this.


Oh, and I think I want to move to Norway, and get laid off, I think I could make do on 80%.
#9 by "Matthew Gallant"
2001-12-11 03:40:06
mg@truemeaningoflife.com http://truemeaningoflife.com
Recipe for success:
I think MMORPG designers have this weird idea that if an activity offers no opportunity to advance your stats, nobody will care. I just want an MMORPG where you can do a group activity besides fighting. And besides Morn's prostitution ring. Final Fantasy XI is going to let you play the Tetra Master card game with the other players. Now that is cool. Throwing a pile of emotes and some dance clubs at players like in AO doesn't provide any more interactivity than hanging out in IRC.
#10 by "Caryn Law"
2001-12-11 03:40:57
carynlaw@pacbell.net
#8 HoseWater
What to say...At least they are trying.  I don't think I've seen a company try as hard as this.


Oh, and I think I want to move to Norway, and get laid off, I think I could make do on 80%.


I have an American friend living in Norway (married a Norwegian woman), and he says the taxes are unbelievable since they have a socialized economy (not sure if it's completely socialized or just parts of it are, such as medicine). He says he pays something like 60% of his income in taxes.
#11 by "Bailey"
2001-12-11 03:42:24
bailey@evilemail.com
Funk

The sad thing is that Funcom made some decent adventure games once. But apparently, they took themselves away from their core compentencies, and now they have to pay the price for it.

Other than TLJ, what was there? And keep in mind, TLJ's suckitude, or lack of therein, is a long and hotly debated topic. Even the hardcore adventure community was split over the response.

Morn

Dammit mr0n, I ctrl-v'd this in the last thread! It is Bailey who deserves recognition! It is Bailey who demands homage! Raaaaargh... okay really don't care, but it's the principle of the thing. I demand everything.
#12 by "Bailey"
2001-12-11 03:43:55
bailey@evilemail.com
Caryn

I have an American friend living in Norway (married a Norwegian woman), and he says the taxes are unbelievable since they have a socialized economy (not sure if it's completely socialized or just parts of it are, such as medicine). He says he pays something like 60% of his income in taxes.

That, and only people at corporate executive level can afford to own cars, houses, etc. Economy's a bitch there, no doubt.
#13 by "HoseWater"
2001-12-11 04:02:14
http://www.opencrap.org
#10 Caryn Law
#8 HoseWater
What to say...At least they are trying.  I don't think I've seen a company try as hard as this.


Oh, and I think I want to move to Norway, and get laid off, I think I could make do on 80%.


I have an American friend living in Norway (married a Norwegian woman), and he says the taxes are unbelievable since they have a socialized economy (not sure if it's completely socialized or just parts of it are, such as medicine). He says he pays something like 60% of his income in taxes.


Hmm, sounds like Canada, should be able to slip right in.
#14 by "Duality"
2001-12-11 04:10:11
Duality@neo-tokyo.org http://urf.gq.nu
#6 FunkDrunk
Should'a stayed with what they knew.

So now companies will use AO as the primest example on why develoeprs should keep making hacked clones of each other.  Great :P

-Duality

I saw this documentary about how codfish have been gill-netted into extinction in Newfoundland, so I went out to Burger King to get a Whaler fish-wich-type breaded deep-fried filet sandwich while there was still time.
#15 by "jafd"
2001-12-11 04:42:53
kallisti@hell.com http://jafd.isfuckingbrilliant.com/
Another topic? Groovy. PC should close down every month!

=====
I am a prototype for a much larger signature.
#16 by "Bailey"
2001-12-11 05:12:55
bailey@evilemail.com
Duality

So now companies will use AO as the primest example on why develoeprs should keep making hacked clones of each other. Great :P

If you want an AO clone, Mimesis Online is going into open beta in a day or two. I've already written it off, but I find most all concepts for "sci-fi" mmogs pretty laughable so far. They inevitably involve some spell-like science. Can't... Escape... EQ... Banality!!!
#17 by "Morn"
2001-12-11 06:27:34
morn@planetcrap.com http://www.planetcrap.com
Neocron is supposed to be pretty good and not too EQ-ish -- haven't seen it myself yet, though.

- Morn
#18 by "Bailey"
2001-12-11 06:44:32
bailey@evilemail.com
Morn

More like "Quake, the MMOG". Since it's real-time combat, no, nothing like EQ.
#19 by "Morn"
2001-12-11 06:50:11
morn@planetcrap.com http://www.planetcrap.com
Bailey: which may be a good thing. IMO.
#20 by "Bailey"
2001-12-11 07:00:08
bailey@evilemail.com
Morn

In as far as "not like EQ", yes, that is a good thing. In as far as "laggy as hell because there's 1000 people trying to rocketjump at once", no, this is a bad thing.

Simply put, if you can't even get lag-free 32-player games with the companies who are the best in the industry at netcode, don't expect a relative unknown newcomer to make a 1000-player MMOG that works better at real-time combat. Everything I've seen so far is laughably hopeless as far as lag goes, even with zone-limited combat. Wait five years, then try again. Same goes for PlanetSide, I'm afraid, which actually looked interesting, but sounds boring. As compared to Neocron, which sounded interesting, but looked crummy.
#21 by "JMCDaveL"
2001-12-11 07:12:41
jmcdavel@mailandnews.com http://www.seizurebots.com
No more like Deus Ex the MMOG.

--jmc
#22 by "Morn"
2001-12-11 07:12:58
morn@planetcrap.com http://www.planetcrap.com
Bailey, are you in the beta? Because I've been wondering about (and somewhat expecting) lag in Neocron. So should I read your post as "I'm in the beta, and lag is horrible", or "I'm not, but I'm pretty sure it won't be too great"?

Just wondering, because I'm very curious when it comes to MMORPGs that break away from the old target-attack-wait structure.

- Morn
#23 by "Bailey"
2001-12-11 07:31:20
bailey@evilemail.com
I'm not in the beta, but, naturally, I'm in contact with several people in the beta who give sweet F.A. about NDAs. Lag is more or less rated as "abominable" currently. I'm awaiting final phase, or personal access, before I write off Neocron completely. I think Sony has more access to resources to provide a viable working engine in the long run, if purely by merit of funds, but their track-record speaks for itself. PlanetSide'll probably get sidelined for SW:G.
#24 by "crash"
2001-12-11 09:24:34
crash@dork.com
i'd like to point out that combat in AC is real-time, as it is in UO, for the most part. EQ, AO, and DAoC all follow the "target-attack-wait" structure, however.

so it is possible. it's not the immediacy of multiplayer FPSs, but as Bailey pointed out, it's a question of scale, and it's extremely unlikely that anything not LAN-speeds-based and -required will ever be that fast.

besides, speed and response time isn't the highest priority in combat in an *.RPG anyway--since RPGs are skills and stats-based.
#25 by "Matthew Gallant"
2001-12-11 09:34:39
mg@truemeaningoflife.com http://truemeaningoflife.com
Combat in MMORPGs isn't even remotely the same paradigm as it is in Quake and its derivatives and does not require anywhere near the amount of bandwidth.
#26 by "Morn"
2001-12-11 10:19:50
morn@planetcrap.com http://www.planetcrap.com
crash, the only difference between AC and the others (AFAIK) is that AC lets you choose how high you attack -- but you still choose a target, enter attack mode, and attack automatically. In UO, I think you even have to click yourself to attack, right? It's been a long time since I played that.

I guess a "Quake MMOG" is one of the many holy grails out there, but I'd be surprised if it happened within the next couple of years (and I'm sure there are enough overly enthusiastic developers out there who'd disagree...).

- Morndrik
#27 by "Cliff"
2001-12-11 10:47:29
cps46@earthlink.net http://www.opencrap.org
I see development on Bailey's 600-lb exoskeleton proceeds apace.
#28 by "Ashiran"
2001-12-11 11:39:47
ashiran@ashrain.net www.wtfpeople.com
I thought we lived in the kapitalist part of the world? You know, where there is competiton between products/services and the best/cheapest ones win over the crappiest/expensive ones.

So can anybody tell me why is Funcom still in buisness?

Oh wait I know! Because people who bought AO and still pay for it every month are IDIOTS!

And we all know that there are lots of idiots. :P
#29 by "MaverickUK"
2001-12-11 12:11:22
peter.bridger@tpg.co.uk http://www.thisstrife.com/
Morn (#26):
I guess a "Quake MMOG" is one of the many holy grails out there, but I'd be surprised if it happened within the next couple of years (and I'm sure there are enough overly enthusiastic developers out there who'd disagree...).


I heard Star Wars:Galaxies were attempting to do this...

--
Mav
\"What kinda shithole planet is this!?\"
#30 by "Morn"
2001-12-11 13:31:45
morn@planetcrap.com http://www.planetcrap.com
Hey, SWG is made by Verant. :)
#31 by "mrbloo"
2001-12-11 13:32:56
mrbloo2000@hotmail.com
#26 Morn

I guess a "Quake MMOG" is one of the many holy grails out there, but I'd be surprised if it happened within the next couple of years (and I'm sure there are enough overly enthusiastic developers out there who'd disagree...).


There have been innumerable flight sims which allowed up to a few hundred people to play at the same time.  I thought AO was like an FPS for shooting people (although what I know about AO wouldn't fill an eggcup so I expect to be corrected).  WW2 online does have FPS style shooting which works reasonably well as far as response and lag goes.  

Question is, would anyone play a Quake MMOG?  DAoC seems like a chat engine with quests thrown in and the kids can't get enough of it :)
#32 by "Ashiran"
2001-12-11 13:47:27
ashiran@ashrain.net www.wtfpeople.com
#31 by mrbloo
Question is, would anyone play a Quake MMOG?

Would anyone play Tribes 2? Yes?

Question anwsered.
#33 by "Anonymous"
2001-12-11 14:14:37
Duality

So now companies will use AO as the primest example on why develoeprs should keep making hacked clones of each other. Great


Not at all what I meant.

When you're moving away from your core comptencies, you should always do them slowly and safely.  For example, they should started with a first person adventure game.  Then they should have built a few games with net code and multiplayer (yeah, I know they did No Escape - but c'mon), and then made AO.  

Trying to do all of it at once was the largest part of the downfall of AO.  IMHO, FWIW, etc.. yada yada yada

Funk.
#34 by "Funkdrunk"
2001-12-11 14:15:03
Last anon was I.


Funk.
#35 by "mrbloo"
2001-12-11 14:17:09
mrbloo2000@hotmail.com
I believe the first M stands for 'Massively'  :p
#36 by "MaverickUK"
2001-12-11 14:46:11
peter.bridger@tpg.co.uk http://www.thisstrife.com/
mrbloo (#35):
I believe the first M stands for 'Massively' :p


or perhaps money... =)

--
Mav
\"What kinda shithole planet is this!?\"
#37 by "wizard"
2001-12-11 15:11:25
wizardque@yahoo.com http://www.opencrap.org
#32 Ashiran
#31 by mrbloo
Question is, would anyone play a Quake MMOG?

Would anyone play Tribes 2? Yes?

Question anwsered.

Question unanswsered...  Did anyone pay to play Tribes 2 on a monthly basis?


I hope not, as the game was highly annoying...

-wizard
#38 by "Duality"
2001-12-11 15:25:29
Duality@neo-tokyo.org http://urf.gq.nu/
#33 Anonymous
Do you feel the same way about Blizzard w/ WoW?

-Duality
A leopard can't change his spots ... oh wait!  He just did!  Good for him!
#39 by "deadlock"
2001-12-11 15:26:29
dealdock@eircom.net
you guys have all got small dicks.

deadlock

flamethrower hates my country...

(sorry, trying to ease myself back into the crap, now that i've established a way around the company proxy)...
#40 by "wizard"
2001-12-11 15:28:04
wizardque@yahoo.com http://www.opencrap.org
#38 Duality
#33 Anonymous
Do you feel the same way about Blizzard w/ WoW?

-Duality
A leopard can't change his spots ... oh wait!  He just did!  Good for him!

Ok, any other company and I'd say, it's going to suck, almost for sure...

But what games of Blizzard's have failed?  I loved em all so far, since Warcraft I up to the recent Diablo II exp...  Ok, so I'm pretty biased, but so far Blizzard has been gold.

-wizard
#41 by "Duality"
2001-12-11 15:29:07
Duality@neo-tokyo.org http://urf.gq.nu/
#37 wizard
Question unanswsered...  Did anyone pay to play Tribes 2 on a monthly basis?

Interestingly enough, I was takling to QIX a long time ago about the community servers (tmail, forums, browser, etc) and one of the things he had originally wanted to do was make a monthly subscription plan, saying he'd have made sure to make a lot more content for that.  Never did get a chance to ask him what sort of content he would have added, tho.

-Duality
A leopard can't change his spots ... oh wait!  He just did!  Good for him!
#42 by "Duality"
2001-12-11 15:36:17
Duality@neo-tokyo.org http://urf.gq.nu/
#40 wizard
I will agree with that.  I may not play all of their games, but Blizzard certainly has a rep for solid games.  But Diablo and the RTS games aren't MMORPGs.  As I'm unfamiliar with the network infrastructure for the b.net service, do they host the game servers, or are those hosted on other players' machines?  I ask this because one of the first things people said when they announced WoW was "Hey, cool!  An MMORPG that you won't have to pay for because they've already got b.net up!"  Obviously, a set of browser / chat servers are quite a bit different and less bandwidth intensive than a game server, if that is the case.

Note I'm not passing judgement on them, but I would hope that they'd take the time to have as seamless an opening as DAoC did.

-Duality
A leopard can't change his spots ... oh wait!  He just did!  Good for him!
#43 by "mrbloo"
2001-12-11 15:38:58
mrbloo2000@hotmail.com
#39, deadlock

(sorry, trying to ease myself back into the crap, now that i've established a way around the company proxy)...


It seems to be off the banned list here, although I found the Google translator very effective when you use it to translate English to English (some leet haxoring of URLs needed of course).  I was mildly put out when safeweb stopped letting people go through them for free, but I imagine their bandwidth bills looked like telephone numbers.
#44 by "FunkDrunk"
2001-12-11 15:51:14
jflavius@bellatlantic.net
#38 Duality

Do you feel the same way about Blizzard w/ WoW?


In many ways I do.  But, Blizzard is a big and rich enough company that they can hire in the expertise to make the game.  And Blizzard has proven that if they feel it can't be done the way they would like to do it, they'll kill the project and eat their losses (ref. Warcraft Adventures).  So I can be fairly confident that they can take this risk, and they will minimize that risk.

Funk.
#45 by "FunkDrunk"
2001-12-11 15:57:58
jflavius@bellatlantic.net
deadlock

you guys have all got small dicks.


Oh yeah?

Oh yeah?

Well.... It's not the size of the boat it's the motion in the ocean....

yeah.. Motion in the ocean....

sniff...

Funk.
#46 by "Ashiran"
2001-12-11 16:01:44
ashiran@ashrain.net www.wtfpeople.com
#37 by wizard
Question unanswsered... Did anyone pay to play Tribes 2 on a monthly basis?
I hope not, as the game was highly annoying...


You just anwsered yourself. Would you pay to play Tribes 2? You won't?
Then you don't want to pay for a Quake MMOG either. Cause it would pretty much be the same as a 64 player game of Tribes 2. Maybe without the vehicles and some more "interaction stuff".

Planetside is gonna blow.
#47 by "Eris"
2001-12-11 16:02:01
#37 by wizard

That game is 100% unplayable on a 3dfx based card, using multiple cards, patches, OS', and the "first aid" craptility. It even causes core dumps :)

Pretty fun with a GTS, though.
#48 by "Ashiran"
2001-12-11 16:03:22
ashiran@ashrain.net www.wtfpeople.com
#39 by deadlock
you guys have all got small dicks./

Ten year of 'excersize' helped a lot for me. :P
#49 by "Bailey"
2001-12-11 16:14:56
bailey@evilemail.com
Cliff

I see development on Bailey's 600-lb exoskeleton proceeds apace.

Do you like my pompadour?

Duality

I ask this because one of the first things people said when they announced WoW was "Hey, cool! An MMORPG that you won't have to pay for because they've already got b.net up!" Obviously, a set of browser / chat servers are quite a bit different and less bandwidth intensive than a game server, if that is the case.

Lots of people like dreaming their way through life.

Considering how often MMOG servers need to be upgraded or replaced, not to mention bandwidth costs, pay per play is inescapable, unless you're being backed by the Swiss Bank and it's excess nazi gold like Project Entropia is, giving away money for items and the game is a free download.

I really don't understand the mentality about this. Sure, the original game should probably be a bit cheaper than standard games, considering A) how reliant you are on the servers being up to even be able to play, and B) the long-term committment you're trying to engage the players in, but shit, it's only 10-15 bucks a month. There is no free ride in this genre.
#50 by "deadlock"
2001-12-11 16:35:02
dealdock@eircom.net
mrbloo:
although I found the Google translator very effective when you use it to translate English to English (some leet haxoring of URLs needed of course).

I haven't checked, but I can almost guarantee that Google's translator is banned here for just that very reason (I know Altavista's one was). My solution involved the (mis)appropriation of an E1 circuit for our data-networking lab :)

deadlock

flamethrower hates my country...
C O M M E N T S
Home » Topic: Here's your monthly AO-related topic

|«« - Previous Page - Next Page - »»|
P O S T   A   C O M M E N T

You need to be logged in to post a comment here. If you don't have an account yet, you can create one here. Registration is free.
C R A P T A G S
Simple formatting: [b]bold[/b], [i]italic[/i], [u]underline[/u]
Web Links: [url=www.mans.de]Cool Site[/url], [url]www.mans.de[/url]
Email Links: [email=some@email.com]Email me[/email], [email]some@email.com[/email]
Simple formatting: Quoted text: [quote]Yadda yadda[/quote]
Front Page (ATOM) • Submission Bin (2) • ArchivesUsersLoginCreate Account
You are currently not logged in.
There are currently 0 people browsing this site. [Details]